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Welcome to the Not Old Better Show, the show covering all things health, wellness, culture, and more. The show for all of us who aren't old, we're better. Each week, we'll interview superstars, experts, and ordinary people doing extraordinary things, all related to this wonderful experience of getting better, not older. Now, here's your host, the award-winning Paul Vogelzang.
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Welcome to the Not Old Better Show Art of Living interview series. I'm Paul Vogelzang. And today, we are about to dive into a remarkable story of resilience, humor, and self-discovery. Our guest is first-time author LMRB Smith, who has written a deeply personal and captivating new memoir that chronicles her coming-of-age journey amid societal upheaval from idyllic childhood here in the Northern Virginia area, and all my audience locally is going to enjoy that part of it immensely. But this childhood took a sudden turn after her parents'divorce to being labeled a troublemaker by her small town. Ellen's story is raw, honest, and ultimately inspiring. But beneath the rebellious exterior is a young soul grappling with loneliness, searching for acceptance, and learning how to stand up for herself, often through laughter, tears, and unexpected friendship. Ellen Smith has written the wonderful new book, Memoirs of a Suburban. troublemaker which we are going to talk about today. But you know, this isn't just a memoir. It's really a celebration of, as I say, resilience, inclusion, and the unbreakable bonds we forge in life's most challenging moments. With wit and poignancy, Ellen R.B. Smith shows us how all the struggles that can come from life can become stepping stones, and how even the darkest times hold the potential for growth. We'll enjoy Ellen today who will share why she wrote this memoir, not for revenge, but to offer hope to those struggling in broken homes, feeling like outsiders, or just trying to find their place in the world. Whether it's the hilarity of youthful escapades or the weight of profound realizations, Ellen R.B. Smith's story serves as a powerful reminder that we are all a work in progress, as she likes to say. And sometimes the most important lessons are hidden beneath the surface of a good joke. We'll hear a little bit about that today. So please get ready for a conversation filled with laughter, insight and inspiration. I'm thrilled to welcome Ellen R.B. Smith to the Not All Better Show. Ellen R.B. Smith, welcome to the program. Ellen R.B.
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Smith Thank you so much.
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Well, thank you for joining us. Congratulations on this wonderful book. I want to hold it up, make sure. everybody can see this and the cover is so wonderful. You've written this fantastic new book, Memoirs of a Suburban Troublemaker. We're going to get into it, but this is, I know, a first book for you. I love the cover. I can tell by the cover that you are in fact a troublemaker. Is that kind of what you were going for?
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Yes. I was 16 in that picture and I wrecked that car about two months after.
- Speaker #1
Oh, I'm sorry.
- Speaker #2
What's funny is, a friend of mine did the cover for me. I found the picture and she designed it. Her name is Erica Cohen, another South Lakes grad. So...
- Speaker #1
South Lakes. We're talking about South Lakes, Virginia. And you, of course, are based here in the Northern Virginia area. That's where I'm based as well. And so it's really nice to talk to you about that aspect of your childhood and many of your formative years. And so I definitely want to get into kind of all of those subjects with you. But let's start with... For all of us, and certainly for all of us that know Northern Virginia life, there's beautiful forests, lovely trails for us to walk on, great, great cultural activities, just lovely. And you certainly had what I'll call kind of a blissful childhood that was interrupted in a divorce. And it really changed you. You talk about it in the book. You became angry. There were some real issues. Tell us a little bit about that stage in your life and set up. the rest of the book about some of these struggles that ultimately shaped you?
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When we moved to Reston, Virginia in 1980, we lived in this beautiful neighborhood right across the street from the three schools that I would eventually attend. It was a picturesque neighborhood. We were a nuclear family surrounded by other nuclear families right on the lake. And I had a best friend across the street who was just like me in that she was an agnostic, non-practicing Jewish. little girl. And we just loved our adventures together. After the divorce, when I was eight years old, Everybody just seemed to move on with their lives. And my mom got a day job that I felt stole all the attention away from me. And my father started dating right away. My sister didn't really remember what it was like before the split because she was so young. She was only five. And I thought if my parents could fall out of love that easily with each other, then maybe the same thing could be said for the love that they had for me. And as far as my construct of family, ultimately, I certainly took my time. Choosing my forever partner in life, I waited until my late 30s to have kids because the divorce was that scarring for me. It shaped my fundamental beliefs or lack thereof of even a higher power. But I wanted to be 100% sure that I was in love with the right person who was committed to being a husband and a parent. I feel like I was successful in that endeavor, not to blow my ending, but it is a happy ending because I have a couple of friends that have started reading it and said it was really difficult. especially my family members, to read about the feelings that I had during the divorce.
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And you do spend a fair bit of time talking about family. And just the mere fact that you've written this memoir that is so inclusive of all of these times, it had to have been difficult. But I noted that the foreword is written by your mom, Kitty Bernard. And I thought that was lovely. That's just a nice show that during difficult moments, family can stay and remain. I'm sure that's how you feel.
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It is. And she is such a champ for doing that for me. I mean, there were definitely times in the book where I had to go back and rewrite sections of it. But yeah, in the end, she was very, very supportive. And I wanted to give her that opportunity to say her piece, because we all have different perceptions of the past. And I just feel like it was her moment to also be reflective. So I'm very lucky to have her in my life. And supportive of this book.
- Speaker #1
In addition to the wonderful cover photo of you in the car that you later wrecked, there are lots of other great photos, including one of your mom at her first prom. And so you can just tell how special she is. That's a lovely picture, by the way. I know my audience is going to absolutely relate to your mom and the hairstyle. She's a knockout, absolutely. Well, tell us about being a troublemaker then, because there were some tough times. times and tough moments where you were a little bit of probably out of control. Would you describe yourself in that way too?
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Yeah, out of control. I'm so angry that the anger actually took over it. I talk about how I have an alter ego named Zelda, which is a name that my mom jokingly was going to give to me because I was complaining about the name Ellen. I thought it sounded like an old lady's name, but I used it as the name for my alter ego because I was so out of control. when I was in these situations where I was being bullied and then standing up for others in these arguments. But I self-alienated and I couldn't articulate why the hurt of the divorce ran so deep. I felt like my whole world was turned upside down and everyone left me behind. And I didn't have time to grieve the death of my parents'love for each other. And it is a death. And if you listen to people that talk about their parents getting divorced, it's often how it's referred to. Hence the chapter, let's go to funerals. Like even back then, I had a friend who died of cystic fibrosis when I was eight. Same time as my parents were going to divorce and I couldn't let my emotions go. Like everybody else was crying around me when that was announced. And I just thought I was going to explode and become this terminally pathetic, weeping basket. So I bottled up all my emotions and eventually that sadness turned into something else more nefarious. I thought, I'm just going to do a bunch of stupid to get my parents'attention. It was my way to alienate myself from my parents because I didn't feel like they loved me at the time. Of course, they did. But that was the start of my serious troublemaking. But I think I was always rebellious when it came to sleep and my personal sense of fashion. But I think I also became an advocate of others because I was inspired by some of my mother's stories and my friend Bahija's. And I started to take notice of others who were being bullied or suffering from some kind of alienation themselves. And I wanted to help them feel better because in doing so, it ended up healing myself. And still to this day, that happens. I just had a friend stay with me for a weekend and he was going through something. And I'm going through something. My husband just broke his foot. And I've been having to do all of the dishes and the laundry and mow the lawn and all of his chores too, which I actually enjoyed. mowing the lawn, by the way. But it's been hard. And having that friend over and helping her go through this difficult time, it's actually helped me. get through this as well.
- Speaker #1
I noticed this theme of advocacy and inclusivity throughout the book. And again, touching on the photos, I loved all the photos, by the way, there's a beautiful photo of the pride parade and the glamazon booth. And I could just tell from that photo, as well as everything that you write about that you have a real part of you that wants to help and wants to be there to support and This really was brought out in so many ways in the book, but I loved this. And you mentioned Bahija, maybe talk about that bond that was created and how that idea of connection and solidarity really applied to a lot of these other moments in your life, including the ideas of inclusivity and being part of an advocacy kind of element.
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Yeah. I mean, Bahija was just a lifeline for me. We were so lucky to have each other. Life is always better when you meet somebody who will be in your corner and... whose goal is to make you laugh in times of adversity and vice versa. I mean, I definitely wanted to make her laugh too. And I was just blown away by her loyalty and her protective spirit. At the time, I felt like she was the only person who really saw me in a way that I couldn't see myself. And by helping me and mentoring me, she taught me how to fix my awkward gait, like how to walk without knock knees and pigeon toes. And she was the only one who came to my rescue when I broke my ass when a kid. chopped down the hammock that I was sitting on with a machete. She was the only one who followed me home. And she would walk me all the way to Langston Hughes Intermediate School and then backtrack all the way to South Lakes because she was older. And I know that was time consuming, but she was genuinely concerned about my well-being. And that changed my perception of myself. Because she led by example, I felt like I could be courageous and I could stand up for others. That was a transformative relationship that I wouldn't have had. And my parents not gotten divorced and our socioeconomic status been downgraded into, you know, my parents having to find apartments and my mother, a townhouse. And I thought it was really crappy at the time. Instead of being bitter about that, I found this wonderful light in my life, which was Pahija.
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You also write about the fashion that you yourself wear. And I thought that was very touching and sweet too, because your economic circumstances were such that you were really only in a position to...
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be able to afford so much and and you know so one outfit yeah it was an outfit for the first day of school but i chose wrong or i chose an outfit that i thought looked great but it was more like i think i said a victorian librarian from the 1800s instead of a tween from the
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1980s but you also get this sense of your own sense of humor which I think is so important, especially as we age. You know, we need to look at life and have a little bit of a positive approach to it. I think life is hard, as you point out throughout the book, but you have this really nice sense of humor. Where did that come from?
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I am slightly obsessed with female comedians. Like their memoirs got me through COVID and writing this book. Honestly, like I just.
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So I'm thinking like Tina Fey, perhaps, or I mean, who? Who?
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Amy Schumer,
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Jessica Afton,
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who writes for Amy Poehler. I mean, there's so many. I don't want to leave anybody out, but oh my gosh, I'm so enamored with them. And I really wanted to write a book that made people laugh, that took people on a journey because I feel like really good books, you have to get really personal and reveal things about yourself that are hard to talk about in the difficult times. And now more than ever, it's important to discuss those because I think it takes the power. away from the negativity or the negative impact that it had on your life at the time. Being able to talk about real situations in life is equated with happiness. I've always equated laughter and situational awareness with that. And I think we have to see the humor in life in order to circumvent those darker moments. It's always easier to laugh at a situation once you've survived it. I've always had a strong sense of justice, but... I have a self-depreciating humor and I'm okay if people are laughing at me as long as they're laughing. Sometimes, sometimes it's just me and I don't prefer that, but I'm always the first one on the dance floor. And thank you for catching that, by the way, the humor in my book, I was really going for it. So.
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Yeah. Well, I mean, Kitty had to have had a sense of humor too, right? I mean, to get through. Yeah. I mean, so that. I think some of that is generational. I think it comes down, you update it, certainly, by finding those in the kind of the current culture that have a good sense of humor that you can kind of look to. But I think it does come from who we are and our family history and that natural DNA.
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Yeah. I mean, both my parents have this art of comedic timing that I've always tried to emulate. And even my grandfather, my dad's dad, Pop-Pop, who I try to compare to Bob Simon in the book, but he always used to make everyone laugh, sometimes with dirty jokes. And I try to ask my aunts to give me those jokes and they refuse. They're like, no, we don't want him remembered that way. But I remember him getting the whole crowd laughing. So hopefully that came down.
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We're talking today in Northern Virginia. And you, of course, were raised in Reston, Virginia for many, many years. And that plays a role in the book. Clearly, you just mentioned Bob Simon. So maybe tell us the Bob Simon story, why that's important to you, and how that really gives you this sense of what it means to be an advocate because he served that and your grandfather too.
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Being from Reston, I'm sure you already know this story. But for the listeners that don't know it, I just want to point out that Bob Simon had four Jewish grandparents. He felt like a second-class citizen his whole life, even though he went to Harvard and used his father's, the income that he made from Carnegie Hall to buy the land that is now Reston. 50 banks turned him down when he wanted to finance the whole thing because he wanted to make it an open and integrated community in a red Confederate state before federal housing laws, before the Civil Rights Act, before Virginia versus Loving. So it was really groundbreaking. And I was really... inspired by that. I was privileged enough to get to meet Bob Simon. And I've just always worshipped him. He's a hero to me and a celebrity to most people in Reston. But the mere fact that I didn't hear phrases like Jew someone down or Jack, Jewish American princess, while I was growing up was a double-edged sword. Hearing those and similar anti-Semitic phrases was shocking to my young adult self, yet validated for me the success of Bob Simon's visionary town of Reston. As an older and wiser adult, I now know more about the injustices of the world for people of color, their various religions, different cultures, and sexual orientations. These injustices caused me to open up and embrace the persecuted. My friends call me a rainbow. I love all shapes and sizes and colors. And Reston is so welcoming to all walks of life. I just hope that hearing this and reading my book, too, people become more curious about learning about Reston's story. and are influenced to live where diversity is important for the growth of the community.
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Our guest today, of course, is Ellen R.B. Smith, who has written the fantastic new book, Memoirs of a Suburban Troublemaker. Again, Ellen, congrats on this book. It takes a lot to write. And as a first-time author, you can tell how much work you really put into it. I mentioned the pictures, the chapter titles, I think are wonderful. And you really weave in throughout the book these themes of adolescence and identity and i really got this notion of kind of a desire for independence particularly as you struggled what advice would you give to young people here locally we talked about kind of the importance of returning to reston for young people it's tough times particularly for young people tell us tell us some advice remember
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that your parents are not perfect they're flawed human beings just like everyone else And they have problems that frequently have little to do with you. You should always work to be yourself by discovering your own strengths. I like to say try everything like Shakira, every sport, art, instrument, plays, chorus, stem. I wish I had done a little bit more stem or any. Because you never know what you're good at until you try it. I also recommend journaling every night because writing down your feelings again takes power away from people that are... trying to hurt you. And we're all allowed to feel sadness and to fall down in life, but getting up and finding inner strength will guide you to self-satisfaction or actualization if you're a fan of Rogers and Maslow's hierarchy of needs or success in whatever way you measure it. Also, you might want to write a book someday too. So, reflection is always a good thing and you don't need to always fit in. So, try to find friends that truly support you and cut the toxic ties.
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I like that. I hope... that the music theme will come out to young people too, because I know enough about you now in my research and after reading your wonderful book, that music is an important element, both to your youth and even to this day. Did you want to be a rock star?
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Oh gosh, yes. Oh, and I just know how hard. I had a failed dream of mine, but I came up with new dreams and my definition of success is different now, but I do feel like there's still time.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, absolutely. I think there's always time. Right. Second act is ahead for you, Ellen.
- Speaker #2
Yeah.
- Speaker #1
How did you balance this wonderful storytelling? with kind of the personal aspects, because it can be challenging to write some of these stories. And I would imagine that family members, I don't know if you gave an editorial option for some of the family members, but did you hear from any that really felt like this is just, we can't go forward with this? And maybe tell us about some of the stories that really jumped out at you in terms of wonderful ones to share and maybe a story that you couldn't share in the book.
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Yeah. I mean, I can tell you this. My sister, who's very diplomatic, she's the mediator of the family, and everyone thought she was going to grow up to be a shrink. She's an executive now in a major company. But she was like, you don't want to put anyone's worst moments out there. I feel like I got to the crux of some of the conflict resolution by talking about how, in the end, I was able to repair all my relationships, but it was definitely a struggle. And recalling my challenging moments brought back some bitter memories. But I needed to stay on track and remember the positive outcomes of those situations and focus on the broader picture in the future. And I believe I've been successful in that. But yeah, I did give some editing power to my immediate family members.
- Speaker #1
Good,
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good. Some of my feedback was, you are fair.
- Speaker #1
Okay. Well, again, congrats on this. How about readers? Now that the book's been out a little bit, again, just fantastic. Congrats on this wonderful memoirs. of a suburban troublemaker. Have you heard from the rest of your audience about struggles that they've had and how the book has kind of helped them overcome some of that?
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Yes. Recently, my mom, who likes to do water aerobics, was stopped by her instructor and the woman asked her if she was my mom and said that she really enjoyed my book because she grew up in Reston and the story resonated with her in her own life. And then she related to my college experiences as well because it made her laugh. I'm like, did it? The most rewarding feedback has come from children of divorce who told me how my book guided them on a healing journey. Like that just warmed my heart and brought me to tears. I loved hearing about the nostalgia that my story was able to evoke. So those are my happier ones. Liz 219, I don't know who you are, but you can go pound sand.
- Speaker #1
We'll put that one in the show notes for you.
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It was just like terrible. I couldn't read it.
- Speaker #1
Wow.
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If you want.
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Liz doesn't. No, we'll make sure that Liz gets shouted down properly because the book is wonderful. And again, congratulations. These are not easy things to do, especially to talk about something so personal. And you really do touch on these wonderful moments of self-discovery. And you talk a lot about vulnerability. And I wonder if you'd touch on that for our audience, too, because I think we're all vulnerable. You have a very nice way of putting this. You just say we're all a work in progress. And as such, none of us are perfect. We're all vulnerable to what's going on around us.
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Yeah, I'm so vulnerable right now. Yes, I'm not a fully evolved human yet. But I think acknowledging that helps take away some of the impossible pressures of life to be perfect. I poured my heart and soul in this book you, Barb, write. It took me years to transform it from 175,000 word journal into a fully fledged story that I can be proud of. But launching it was super scary because it was like broadcasting my whole life, dirty laundry and all to the world to be judged. Also, there are really very real Nazis flying swastika flags all over the country and on Instagram. And I'm fully aware that this book could make me a target. And I might be overly optimistic, but I somehow feel like saying it out loud protects me. I'm vulnerable as a mother of two young girls and I'm about to turn 50. And I'm going through a horrible... So far, four years of menopause, but I'm learning every day. Children are not carbon copies of their parents and just figuring out who they are and what they're thinking is a daily experience of growth and understanding. And it will continue for me to be part of my journey as a lifelong endeavor.
- Speaker #1
Well, yes, let's shout down hate too and give you big props for all of your honesty and just such a wonderful story. And so... well told and just a beautiful book to share, I think, with others. I look forward to sharing it. I look forward to our audience responding. Maybe tell us what's next for Ellen. Could we see this in a film setting? Could we see... Is that the goal? Okay, good. Well, we're breaking. Are we breaking some news here?
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I'm serious. I would love to see either a movie or a TV series. I've got a friend in California that I went to college with and I'm like, can you help me? And... She's like, LA is dead right now. Just write it and we'll take it from there. So I haven't started it yet, but that is the end goal. Absolutely. I have neighbors across the street that are super solid people. And we talk about how we should become songwriters. I mean, we're all over the place as far as like, you know, just putting more art into the world that inspires people to be better people.
- Speaker #1
Well, my best to you, Ellen Arby Smith. Thank you so much for your time today. And we look forward to talking to you again. Of course, Ellen's new book is Memoirs of a Suburban Troublemaker. We're gonna have you back. Ellen, I want to make sure and stay in touch, but what a joy to talk to you again. Thanks for this wonderful book and for being so honest. I think this is the kind of thing that we need more of in the world. So I appreciate your time today and please stay in touch and come back and talk to us.
- Speaker #2
Absolutely. Thank you so much for the opportunity, Paul. This has been wonderful.
- Speaker #1
My thanks to author Ellen R.B. Smith for her time today. Her book is wonderful, the title of which is Memoirs of a Suburban Troublemaker. We will have links. so that our audience can find out more about Ellen and her wonderful new book. But you got to check this out. My thanks, of course, to our executive producer, Sam Henniger, for all of his work. My thanks to all of you, our audience here on radio and podcast. Please be well, be safe, and let's talk about better. The Not Old Better Show on radio and podcast. Thanks, everybody. We will see you next week.
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Thanks for joining us this week on the Not Old Better Show. To find out more about all of today's stories, or to view our extensive back catalog of previous shows, simply visit notold-better.com. Join us again next time as we deep dive into some of the most fascinating real life stories from across the world, all focused on this wonderful experience of getting better, not just older. Let's talk about better. The Not Old Better Show.
- Speaker #1
Hi, one final thing. Please check out our website for this episode and all episodes at notold-better.com or subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts, And be sure to check out your local radio stations to find out more about the Not Old Better Show on podcast and radio. You can find us all over social media. Our Twitter feed is Not Old Better. And we're on Instagram at Not Old Better, too. The Not Old Better Show is a production of NOBS Studios. I'm Paul Vogelsang. And I hope you'll join me again next time to talk about better. The Not Old Better Show. Thanks, everybody. We'll see you next week.
