The Power of Compounding | The Journey Podcast

Description

In this enlightening episode of The Journey Podcast, hosts Adam and Michael Baker delve deep into the transformative power of integrating the four pillars of wellness—spiritual, mental, physical, and financial—into our lives. The discussion emphasizes that true health and happiness stem from a holistic approach, where each pillar supports and enhances the others. As entrepreneurs and executives navigate their journeys, understanding how these pillars interconnect is vital for achieving overall wellness and wealth.

Listeners will discover how the concept of compounding interest applies not only to financial investments but also to personal growth across all areas of life. Adam and Michael explore practical strategies for achieving financial wellness, emphasizing the importance of proactive health measures that can significantly impact financial stability. They advocate for a shift in mindset, encouraging individuals to invest time and resources into personal and family development rather than material possessions, highlighting that experiences often yield greater happiness and fulfillment.

The conversation also addresses the often-overlooked implications of social isolation, shedding light on how nurturing relationships can enhance mental health and contribute to financial success. In a world where business and personal life can feel overwhelming, this episode serves as a reminder that our journey toward wellness is interconnected. By aligning financial goals with personal values and aspirations, listeners can create a life filled with purpose and meaning.

Throughout this engaging dialogue, Adam and Michael share their insights on self-improvement and the significance of maintaining balance in all areas of life. They challenge listeners to take actionable steps toward integrating wellness into their daily routines, fostering a mindset that prioritizes health, happiness, and financial security.

Tune in to this episode of The Journey Podcast for an inspiring exploration of how to cultivate a fulfilling life by harmonizing the four pillars of wellness. Whether you're an aspiring entrepreneur, a seasoned executive, or simply someone on a journey of self-discovery, this episode offers valuable takeaways that can help you thrive in all aspects of life. Don’t miss out on the opportunity to learn how to create a wealth of health and happiness by embracing a holistic approach to wellness. Join us as we embark on this journey together!

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Transcription

Speaker #0
Welcome to The Journey Podcast, a show dedicated to health, wealth, and happiness. Join us on the journey as we explore the world your health and wealth make possible. Welcome back to The Journey Podcast. Today, we are joined by my colleague, Michael Baker, for his second appearance. Michael, welcome back.
Speaker #1
Happy to be here.
Speaker #0
Great. Just thinking about this, the first thing that popped into my mind is like when the SNL, when someone gets the five hosting appearance jacket. So I'm sure you'll get to that pretty soon.
Speaker #1
Fantastic. I hope it's green and I get one every couple of years.
Speaker #0
A few thoughts that run through my head, but just kind of funny. Great. Well, I think what we're going to talk about today. is a little bit of where we left off on the first episode that we did in this podcast. And it's really kind of integrating those four pillars that we talk about at the firm and we've talked about with guests since then, spiritual, mental, physical, and financial. And really looking back to those guests and bringing forward some of the thoughts, perspectives that they provided and integrating that back into what we are doing at Journey when it comes to financial planning. and really financial wellness as a whole. The first thing I would really like to start off with, and this is going to be a little cliche, is a quote. Something that has really resonated with me from one of my favorite humans, Kevin Kelly. Kevin Kelly was the founder of Wired Magazine. If you remember that commercial, one of the most interesting humans in the world, first person hired on the internet, was cycling around in the 70s on a bicycle in Afghanistan. I mean... has done everything and anything. But I'm going to start with this quote because I think it's really going to set up the conversation for today. All the greatest prizes in life, in wealth, relationships, or knowledge come from the magic of compounding interest. By amplifying small, steady gains, all you need for abundance is to keep adding 1% more than you subtract on a regular basis. And I think really when you pull on the idea of compounding interest, for example, and then apply that to all of those pillars we talk about. And I think that really... sets the tone for the conversation. So I want to pivot that back and just tell me, what do you take from that quote? And how does that set up what we're going to talk today about what you do at the firm in that planning process and really financial wellness broadly? Yeah,
Speaker #1
absolutely. Well, first and foremost, I just want to say how fun it's been to see kind of the development of the podcast. I think the guests have been great and you've done a great job. So excited to be here and rehash some of that. But, you know, going back to the quote, when when we think about compounding interest, oftentimes we think of that exclusively related to money, but the reality is it doesn't matter what you do, whether it's time you spend with your kids, money that you put into an investment account, time you spend, you know, at church or, you know, working on your mental health with therapists or whatever it might be, investing the time and getting 1% better every day. The impact that that has on all aspects of your life over a long period of time is truly remarkable. People have a tendency to overestimate what they can do in a short period of time and significantly underestimate what they can do over a long period of time. And what we try to do is help people understand that you're not going to be able to make changes to many of the things that are really important to you over the next week. But if we can give you the tools and we can set a roadmap for you to feel comfortable and confident about your ability to make changes over a long period of time by making small decisions one day on to the next, the end result is going to be a place where you feel a lot better about where you are and a lot more confident about your ability to make those changes moving forward.
Speaker #0
Yeah, I think that is great. And I really do stick to that idea of 1%, getting 1% better every day. And anything you do usually leads to the outcome you're looking for. And I want to pull that back again, back to financial wellness. And really thinking about the guests we've had on the show, Brad and Drew and Sarah, touching on really the key components, for example, of mental health or physical health or spiritual health. You know, what foundationally is key for all of those things is financial wellness. And having a strong financial base. or foundation really kind of sets the tone and allows you to take a bigger leap, for example, into those other three key pillars. How do you think about that financial wellness piece in the clients you're working with? And what have you seen that having that strong foundation has it opened the door or allowed them to explore those other components?
Speaker #1
Yeah. Well, I think what's important is that all four pillars are inextricably linked, right? financial wellness is going to give you the means and the opportunity to invest in yourself, whether that be investing in personal training, you know, therapy, coaching, any number of different things. Having the financial means to be able to support those endeavors is really important. But the flip side to that is if you don't. take the time to invest your time, talent, and treasure into developing the person that you want to be, that will have an impact on your ability to generate the financial base that's going to support your ability to continue to develop in those areas. So I think it's really important, and we talk about this often at Journey, is that you can't look at one independently, but understanding that the investment in the other areas, will lead to continued growth from a financial perspective is really the differentiator and where we're seeing a lot of a lot of our clients start to really wrap their arms around and appreciate what it is that we're trying to bring to them.
Speaker #0
Yeah, and I want to I want to touch on one thing you just mentioned is the capability or the capacity for growth. When you start to invest in one of those or another, and then more importantly, the impact long term. We had Dr. Brad Patton on. He talked a lot about that shift from reactive medicine or health to proactive medicine or health, meaning let's look at where you are now. What can we get out in front of much earlier on? And when you take the lessons or some of the things he shared, you know, exercise, nutrition, you know, proactively going to see the doctor before something happens. How? How do you take those components and what he's talking about and then bring that specific piece of physical health into the financial wellness perspective? One thing I think about, of course, is insurance and that planning process. But could you kind of extrapolate that and go in a little bit more detail about that connection to those two and bringing it back to the financial wellness bucket?
Speaker #1
Yeah, you know, When we think about the impact of physical health on finances, there have been studies where they've looked at how does your physical health impact your ability to generate income, right? And one of the studies have showed that exercise, meaning roughly three days a week, leads to 6 to 10 percent higher income, right? So those who regularly exercise. are able to generate a significantly higher income, right, on average up to $6,500. And so when we think about, you know, encouraging folks to do that, right, they come to us and they think investing is a very specific thing, right? Wealth management, we're going to talk about investment, so on and so forth. But when we encourage them to invest their time in, you know, focusing on their health, that's going to translate into better mental health. You're going to show up and you're going to be more successful at work. And so when we think about the planning process, what we want to do is make sure that they're not just there to have a conversation around what their portfolio looks like. We're going to begin that financial planning process with getting an understanding of what's important to them. What are the components of their life that are going to drive the ability to achieve their goals? And then how do we help them think about using their means to support? those various aspects of their life. And by taking all of that into consideration through the planning process and getting them to focus on what's important, it shifts the conversation away from strictly financial and really helps them focus on, you know, what is their mission? What's their vision for the future? Not only invest on the financial side of things, but also investing their time and investing, you know, their talent and assisting those around them in getting better as well.
Speaker #0
Yeah, I think that's very thoughtful. One of the words you mentioned that is kind of family vision or personal vision. You know, however you want to think about that. I know that is incorporated in our plan at the firm, which is maybe a little bit unique or different. And it really makes me think about a book that you and I both love, Die With Zero by Bill Perkins. And there's a chart that I speak to and use. I know you do the same. And what it does is reflects on, you know, People's wealth as they get older. The idea being that if you do all the things in the plan and take the right steps, your wealth is going up. But as you get older, if you're not focused on that physical health bucket, the propensity or capacity and capability of the things you can do is kind of going the other way. So at some point, there's an inflection point together. But eventually, if you're not doing those things to invest in your physical health, it really starts to separate. And that gap between. Being able to take that incredible ski trip or, you know, go hiking in the mountains out west for seven days, right? You have the money and the capability in terms of financially, but you don't have it on the physical set. And how do you take that idea and translate that back to clients so that they understand, to your point originally, none of this is mutually exclusive?
Speaker #1
Yeah, I think, you know, again, oftentimes the conversation is so focused around saving and. building this nest egg that's going to support this idea of what retirement in the future might look like. But the reality is if you're not. able to do the things you want to do physically, whether that's taking trips, spending time with your grandkids and really engaging with them, whatever it looks like to you. If you're not physically capable of doing it, what's the purpose of saving all of this, right? You know, we talk about the difference between health span and lifespan. I would rather live 90 really good years than live 100 with the last 10 being miserable and not being able to do. I might have all the money in the world, but if I'm physically unable to do anything that allows me to enjoy my life, what's the point? So, you know, we always try to balance the now versus the future. And I'm certain we'll dive into that a little bit later. But really helping them understand when you structure what your goals and objectives are, don't just isolate that out into the future. It should be informed by the things that you can do today, which sort of. Goes back to what we talked about earlier. If you get 1% better, what can you do today that's going to have an impact and lead to the successes that you're looking for 20, 30 years from now?
Speaker #0
Yeah. And I want to touch on kind of a couple of the things that our other guests said, but I do want to hit on one item you just mentioned. And it's something I think a lot about. You know, I think in the advice space, in the planning space, to your point, you know, a lot of it is based on, you know. 10, 20, 30 years down the road, right? If someone that comes in, they're 35, they're 40. And you often in the advice space, we're talking about when you retire at 65 or 70, you know, what are you looking for? What do you want? Which is a critical component. But what I want to speak to is what you said about right now, right here. And something I think we do at the firm is No, you should take this trip or you should sign up for this class or you should do that. Spend the money now because you have the capacity to do it. And then we'll think about, you know, how you will be in the future. So can you tie those two together for me? Because I think that is thinking a little bit different.
Speaker #1
Yeah, well, to use a financial term, we talk about return on investment, right? So a dollar invested today, we expect a certain amount of return on that. And I don't think we apply that to the experiences that we create for ourselves in life, right? You and I both know what you're able to do now, whether it's climb a mountain, go on a safari, whatever it might be, you're likely to enjoy that more at 40 than you might at 65 when a lot of people think about retiring. So return on investment is not strictly financial, right? It's a return from a spiritual standpoint, from a mental health standpoint, from a physical standpoint. So that's really how I think about it is you need to invest today in being the person you want to be today, because if you do that, you're not going to look back at 65 and say, what if, right? Getting to 65 with a pile of money is going to give you the means to do a lot of things. But what did you give up along the way? And what return on investment are you going to get at 65 compared to what you might have gotten at 40?
Speaker #0
Yeah, that's that's great. Right. That term. ROI and what it really means. And, you know, people, when people think about return on investment, it's often how quick can I get that investment back? And I think that is a hard thing that I have seen is getting people to think about, you know, what you're putting in now, you know, may get a quick return, but at some point that ROI could be way down the road. And I think you just said it. There's an amazing paper titled by, I believe, Dunn, Gilbert, and Wilson. And the paper is, if money doesn't make you happy, then you're probably not spending it right. And my favorite piece from that, great title for a research paper, but what they talk about in that is experiential purchases and material purchase. And I think you just referenced the idea of experiential purchases, meaning the benefit and the impact. that someone gets from that as spending their capital, right? And how can you do it and what can you do it? And why I mentioned that is leaning into some of the things that I heard from both Drew and Sarah when it came to the emotional or mental health side. Meaning, you know, when you think about your mental health, it kind of a key component for us is thinking, for example, about social, right? The idea of those relationships. And we could cite the research over and over again, how important relationships are and what they mean to people. So could you touch on the idea that how we connect those dots for people, meaning, you know, when you think about spending on those trips or you think about, you know, your relationships and the social and emotional health aspect, how you're integrating that in. I know we talk a little bit about, you know, what wealth means to people. We touch on core values at the firm. We touch on that vision piece, which I think all of those anchor into things that they spoke about. Specifically that, hey, you have to have all these components dialed in when it comes to the relationships with yourself, your family, your friends. And that is an important part because if not, I know you have seen that and what it means to the financial wellness aspect.
Speaker #1
Yeah, I think it's really important. And I'll use an example for myself. When we think about what our family vision is, and we've recently been thinking about this a lot, and I've used this phrase several times already today, right? We want to invest our time, talent, and treasure to support our family, support our community. and invest in the things that we want to do to make sure that we're living the lives we believe we deserve and we want, right? And so as, you know, a family, what are we doing? How are we connecting with those around us? How are we setting time aside to make sure that we're investing in each other? We're investing in our community. We're investing in experiences. And so, you know, I think it's really important. When you think about that level of community, you know, I forget the statistic. I'll kick this one back to you. But the impact of social isolation, right? And we can be isolated when we're surrounded by people. I find a lot of people isolate themselves in their work, right? So you can go to work every day and you can make all the money in the world and buy all. Quantitative metrics can be super successful. But while your bank account might be off the charts. Your happiness isn't even hitting the chart, right? And so when we think about making sure people are engaged, it starts with understanding what's important to them and what they're doing to make sure that they're engaged on that. I would be curious when you see people that are failing to connect with others, how do you see that factor into their financial life?
Speaker #0
Yeah, I mean, one, I'll go back to the you mentioned about stats. I do love stats. Social isolation and loneliness. This is recent data coming from the Surgeon General who has actually put out a, you know, for a broader term, a crisis when it comes to isolation and loneliness within the United States. And I think I may have mentioned this in our conversation with Brad, but it's isolation and loneliness is the equivalent of six drinks a day or 15 cigarettes in terms of the impact to your physical health, which is just shocking when you think about it. And you really, you know. put that into perspective. So bringing that piece back 100% in terms of the impact of relationships. We know, for example, humans are the most social creatures on this planet. There's only like three other animals that create complex social environments as us. I think it's naked mole rats, termites. And some other insect, some weird piece of it. So, of course, that is a huge component. And I think you see that in the way people do. As a coach who works with executives and a lot of entrepreneurs and business owners, you and I both know the time it takes to get those businesses off the ground, grow them, and the work that goes into it. I mean, the hours, the commitment. Commitment and the stress is off the charts. The same with C-suite executives. I came from a world in terms of sales where you have people on the road 40, 50 weeks a year. And that distance. Disconnect from that community and the relationships they have is huge. And what do they do with that isolation? Meaning those relationships become fractured. So how are they trying to find connection, right? They may be doing that through spending habits, buying material goods or possessions to kind of fill a certain void. It could be fractured relationships with family, right? Like you and I know statistically when it comes to legacy planning by the second generation, and we may have mentioned this in the first conversation. You know, by the second generation, 70% of family wealth goes away. By the third generation, 90%. What's really interesting about that is the reason that happens is 85% of it is driven by communication or lack thereof. Back to that relationship piece. So when you look at it, it's fractured across the board, right? You know, for example, and Sarah and I mentioned this and we had a conversation on it. So I just want to kind of pull some of the pieces she specifically spoke to. But, you know, divorce over the age of 50 has doubled the last 20 years and expected to triple by 2030. When they started to look at that data, a lot of that is. disconnect in those relationships and also kind of some of the spiritual components about purpose and why that drew talked about. So I think to your point, you know, what, what I have seen, and I think what we see at the firm is of those four pillars, like at some point when one of those is fractured and specifically we're talking about relationships, it completely drips into the financial wellness bucket and all the things that drive that home. And I would, again, throw it back to you because you are the head of experience and planning at the firm. You see this on a daily basis, not only at this firm, but in your previous career. So love to hear just one specific story that you could share where you have seen, you know, I'd love to see the positive one and the negative one, if you wouldn't mind.
Speaker #1
Yeah, getting specific on the spot. That may be tough. But I think what I see. What I see often is you have these business owners that have invested 30, 40 years in developing a business, and they've been successful at doing that by all financial metrics, right? And what they've failed to do is invest in their family, invest in their community. And this isn't always the case, but we see it often because the work that it takes to be successful from a business standpoint is so significant. And, you know... They come to us, they're ready to sell a business, and they don't know what's next, right? So we talk about retirement and people suddenly lose their purpose, right? And so what we ideally seek to do, and I think this is what's really unique about what we're doing at Journey, is what we're seeking to do is help people not just think of it as retirement, but sort of graduating to the next phase of life. Where do you find purpose? How do you prepare for it? Right. And what tools and resources can we place around you to make that transition easier for you? And, you know, I kind of want to go back to a little bit of what you were talking about. I think what's really interesting is that we're seeing generational shifts. The younger generations are much more focused on something called work life balance. Now, you and I have talked about this in the past. Work life balance is an interesting thing. I think it's somewhat of a fallacy. But you see. Generally speaking, the younger generation values PTO, values the ability to have flexibility where they work, what time they work, so on and so forth. But we've also seen an increase in two-income households, right? What are the implications there as we think about engagement with children and the responsibilities of mothers and fathers and how they're engaging with their children with the various activities? And that all has implications from a financial standpoint. Right. But I think what we're seeing is those that lean into what they value are finding ways to support those things. Whereas if they strictly focus on putting food on the table, going back to a 1950s sort of mentality. they lose that connection with their family. And I see all too often the fathers specifically trying to make up for lost time with children that are busy raising their own kids, right? And so you see it try to manifest into grandchildren, things like that. So I think it's really important. And this is one of the things we noticed is you can't just think about the future. You need to identify what's important and invest in it today because you can't get the time back. You can always make the next dollar, but there's nothing you can do to bring back yesterday. And if I don't take the time to go watch my kid play soccer because I need to take a meeting with a prospective client, maybe the client signs with Journey, maybe the client doesn't. But my son did have a game and I'll never be able to see that. So I think, again, when we think about clients and we think about the ways that. We're seeing the generations change. We're trying to change along with them and give them the tools and the resources to make sure that they're truly invested in themselves and their family.
Speaker #0
That's great. I think that's a wonderful example. I feel that way. I think we had like five lacrosse games, two baseball games and sports pictures last weekend while my wife was working, actually. But I want to. pull on two of those components. One, what you said about the tools and resources, and specifically, when you think about all the clients you're working with, you know, how are you presenting those tools and resources to them? And how are you having that conversation and saying, from our planning process, of course, we're going to hit on all the key components, cash flow and, you know, return and investment allocation and making sure all the I's are dotted and the T's are crossed on your... trusts and will, but talk to me about some of those other tools and how you're integrating that into the planning process. Because I think that is the theme that I've heard from the guests we have had, you know, on the last few shows, what we talked about the first time is really surrounding those people with those tools and integrating that, like truly integrating that into the conversation and the planning process.
Speaker #1
I think that's what's fun about what we're doing, right? I would say we're midstream on... making some fundamental shifts to the way that we engage with clients to make sure that they understand all the ways that we can bring value to the relationship. But to answer your question specifically, it all really starts in the beginning of the planning process, right? So rather than diving into the quantitative side of things and getting an understanding, that's obviously important. But we ask clients to go through a process where they communicate what are the values that are important to you. How do you define wealth? And what is your family vision statement, right? And when we understand those things. We can then go into a data gathering mode where we understand what the quantitative side looks like, but we can also communicate to them that part of the process, part of the planning engagement, is how do we align what you told us from a qualitative standpoint? How do we take your family vision, your family values, and make sure that when you are saving or spending, You're doing so in alignment with the things that you said are important, because ultimately what we find is oftentimes people can they can identify values, they can identify vision and mission. But then the actions that they're taking aren't necessarily aligned with that. And so our job in the planning process is to align the vision with the financial side of things and then provide. you know, serve as an accountability partner for our clients. Say, you said this was important to you, right? Just checking in. Did you do X, Y, and Z that we talked about? What was the outcome of that? Do we need to lean more in there? Or are you struggling with that? You know, Adam works with our team. He's the head of coaching and development. Would it make sense to have a conversation with Adam and lean into exploring why this is difficult for you. Or, you know, we have strategic partners like Brad, like Sarah, where we can say, you know, you're struggling from a health standpoint, you're struggling from a mental wellness standpoint. Do you need to talk to somebody about that, making those introductions? So incorporating all of that into a process, right? And focusing on the process as opposed to the product is really, really important. So we Focus on that process, make sure people are engaged, serve as an accountability partner, and provide resources as appropriate.
Speaker #0
Yeah, I think that is really thoughtful. I think you've segued into one of the things I wanted to talk about with the words you used, and that's action. You know, one of the pieces of the plan is actually a pure takeaway action plan. And I think when you think about an action plan in a broader financial blueprint plan sense, it's really the— Hey, did you give us the documentation? We want to look at your spending habits and your cash flows and your current investment statements. But I think when you use the word action, what I hear and I know what I see is that action plan. Meaning between now and our next review or conversation, the idea is you've mentioned you want a house up on Lake Michigan, for example. you know, between now and then, you know, we want that commitment. Are you looking at houses? Have you connected with the bank? Can we help you connect to the bank? You know, that's just one specific example. And I think that level of commitment and integrating that into the plan, because it is a little bit different, right? So if someone comes back to us in six to 12 months and says in our review, We check in, you know, did you take the steps we talked about? And for example, the examples you mentioned, did you hire the trainer? Did you, you know, work with the precision health doctor? Did you, you know, take. the trip you wanted to take. And between then and now, right, if there isn't that action, that momentum, that movement, you know, then we're thinking about where's the friction. Right? And to your point, that is back to that tools piece of, well, once we identify that friction of why you didn't take those steps, to your point. How can we help you do that? Is it you just didn't feel comfortable, right? And if that is true, how can we help you do that? Do you want to have a conversation? Can we help facilitate an introduction? Do we need to bring in one of our partners? The same when it comes to training or nutrition. Hey, have you made the changes we talked about because of the impact to your healthcare costs? So on and so forth. So just, you know, again, wrapping those tools together, I think, is the key piece in the planning perspective. And you mentioned this is something that is really now kind of ingrained in our DNA. Could you talk about a couple of those conversations you have had with clients and what that feedback has been like in presenting those ideas?
Speaker #1
Yeah, what's really interesting about it is, again, we want to work with clients that. understand and value what we do. But the other thing we understand is not everybody comes to us as this perfect fit for this four pillar approach, right? So it starts with educating them about the four pillars and, you know, thinking about what we're here to talk about today, which is financial wellness, how we're defining that. Financial wellness is not just getting to the end of the rainbow with the largest pot of money, right? And so what's nice about the conversation is when you start to lay out what those four pillars are and how they interact with each other. It opens up the dialogue. It makes people feel more comfortable talking about things that, you know, in a prior life where most of what I did was strictly financial, they weren't willing to talk about, they weren't willing to lean into and share why it's important to them. And so, you know, when we can start the conversation, even before the point of them becoming a client, when you can start the conversation with someone telling. We're a multifamily office dedicated and surrounding the needs of our clients, but part of that is investing in the physical wellness, the mental wellness, and the spiritual wellness. What they don't do is they don't ask about all the ways we can help them financially, but they are leaning into, tell me more about that. Tell me, how are you working with clients on their mental wellness or their spiritual wellness or physical wellness? And that's where we have the opportunity to say, you know. We work with Dr. Brad. Precision medicine is something that he's sort of leading the charge on here in Northeast Ohio. You know, we have a partnership with Sarah Saunders. She does a great job working with families that have been through trauma and things of that nature. Right. And as people start to understand all the different ways we can work with them and support the needs, not only that they personally have, but that their family has, it opens up the conversation. And when we. get back to having a conversation about money, they're in a place where they're ready to place it in the context of that holistic wellness that we really focus on. And that's what's been really fun is, you know, being able to take a different approach while having sort of the traditional wealth management firm in the background that we can use as a tool, as a resource. to allow people to do the things that they say are important to them.
Speaker #0
Yeah, I think that's really thoughtful. And one question I do want to ask you is you have a long background in this business in terms of financial advice and planning. And joining the firm here at Journey, you and I work pretty closely. Would love to hear, you know, based upon your background and time in this industry and now coming on board journey and integrating a lot of these components. And you mentioned in our conversation, you know, your family specifically and how you're bringing this home. I would love for you to just talk a little bit more about how this approach has now kind of, for you, transitioned into your own personal world and what that kind of has done in terms of your personal and professional approach.
Speaker #1
Yeah, I mean, I'll be candid with you. It's life-changing. I was fortunate to work with a number of members of the team at a prior firm. So I knew that the people that I was coming to work with at Journey were the type of people that I wanted to work with. And I think, again, that goes back to the isolation, right? I'm invested in work because I enjoy what I do. I enjoy the people that I do it with. And I believe in what we're trying to do to change the industry for the better. But, you know, thinking about the four pillars of wellness, right? Getting my family engaged, right? So we've joined the gym. We go to the gym together, right? My wife and I are having conversations. What should our values be? How do we communicate those values to our children? How do we deal with stressful situations, whether that's around family dynamic, financial dynamics, whatever it might be? It is equipping me with the tools to really lean into those and make sure that I'm investing in them. In my family. And it's it's interesting because, you know, my wife has been through some of the exercises now and she sort of laughs just like this is hard. I'm like, it is hard. And that's that should tell you something. Right. And so I know there's value. I see it. I see the way that it impacts our family. I see the way that it impacts the clients that we're fortunate enough to get to work with. But I also see the excitement. at Journey and what we're building and what the future is going to look like. And I know that my ability to be a part of that is a core part of feeling good, building the happiness and, you know, living the life that I want to live.
Speaker #0
And that's, that's wonderful. I mean, that's the stuff that to your point gets me excited every day is one thing TJ talked about, for example, when he was on is, you know, the idea of like excited to get up, excited to show to work, the people we work with. And when a lot of those things are aligned, you know, the outcome with all of our clients is really dialed in. So to hear that, and I appreciate you sharing it because it does resonate kind of across the board. Again. And the next question I had is, you know, again, kind of tying some of that into now as someone with the expertise in planning that you do have or the insight in planning. What is your favorite part now of the planning process when you take these tools and these pillars and bring them into what you're doing versus maybe 10, 15 years ago?
Speaker #1
Yeah, well, it starts with it starts with accuracy, right? We have to get the quantitative side of things correct, right? But what's different about it and what I enjoy most now is the context that we can place around that. Right. So the ability to have a client say, I want to do this. Historically, the answer was, yes, you can or no, you can't. And, you know, it revolved around Monte Carlo scores. And now it's really I can look at a Monte Carlo score and say, OK, here's the problem. Here are different levers you can pull, but we don't want to sell out. today, you know, in exchange for some future that we may never have, right? The reality is tomorrow is not promised. And so, again, the ability to serve as that accountability partner and say, hey, you said this was important to you. Guess what? Your plan is still fine, right? We're fortunate enough to work with people that generally speaking, the math equation is solved. But what isn't necessarily solved is they're not doing the things they say they want to do. They haven't reached alignment from a... spiritual standpoint, from a physical standpoint, mental standpoint, right? And so leveraging our team and the expertise that we have from financial planning standpoints and executing from an investment standpoint allows us to decouple, not decouple, but focus less on that side or more appropriately get people to understand this is a tool. This is one resource, right? We've got you from a financial standpoint. We're asking you, rather than focusing on that next dollar, focus on the things you said are important. And the clients are responding really well to that. And it's leading to some really rewarding conversations, both for them, but also for us. And that's a win.
Speaker #0
That's great. I mean, to be able for that to be the impact you have every day with each and every client, I think, is truly living your authentic self on top of it. And using that term authentic self, I have two questions I want to ask you. I know you're an avid reader. So when you're thinking about books you have been tapping into lately or maybe sharing with clients, is there one we can leave for the audience that you really love that tie together some of these themes we've talked about and what our past guests have reflected upon?
Speaker #1
Yes. And it has very little to do with our profession. It has very little to do with the conversation. But. But maybe that's not true. So recently, a gentleman in Moscow has come out as a show, and my wife and I have been watching that. And it follows this path of a person that's confined to a Russian hotel. And if he leaves, he'll be killed by the Russian government. And following along on that journey of someone that's confined, right? But what he doesn't do is he's not isolated because he engages with the people around him. Much of his wealth has been stripped away from him, but he is not poor because he understands they can take away his freedom, but they can't take away his happiness. Right. They can't take away his ability to enjoy the life that he can create for himself. So I know it's one of my favorite all time books. Amor Tolles is the author. I know TJ loves it as well. It's something that I know he sent a number of clients. But. It's been fun to kind of watch that revisit the book itself. So that's one I would encourage anybody to read because it's educational, but it's also just a blast to read. You can't put it down. Comical and form informational. Amazing.
Speaker #0
That's great. Thank you for sharing the other one. And you've used this term just now. Yeah. The word create. And what I want to do is tie together. The last three, four guests we have had, the conversation you have had today, what we are doing at Journey. And what I really believe is we are creating a place in a community that is different and or differentiated. And giving people a new approach and allowing them to live that life that they want to live. So when I think about Create, I'm going to think about the rest of this year. And a term I've said over and over at the end for each of our guests, Masogi came from one of my favorite books, why I mentioned it, The Comfort Crisis. What are you creating for yourself through the end of this year? Or what is your Masogi? What are you creating as, hey, this is my big, hard thing as we think about that?
Speaker #1
Yeah, so we've talked about it already. My wife and I are in the process of sort of laying out what is our vision, what is our mission, what are our values. And what are we going to do to invest in those? And I think, you know, when we get to a place where we feel really comfortable with that, finding a way to communicate that to an 11-year-old and a soon-to-be five-year-old, right, that presents its own challenge. But what I know is if we are able to be clear about what our purpose is and we're able to communicate what our values are, we're going to have children that approach the world in a way that... allows them to do the things that they find valuable, right? You talked about how money seems to disappear from one generation to the next, and that comes down to communication. We're focused on raising children. That's the stage of life that we're in. Everything we do from the time we leave seems to revolve around a child going to one place or another. But what's really important to us is making sure they understand what's important to us, what kind of people we want to be. And that they have the ability to think for themselves, extract what they want from what we say, but have a clear vision for the kind of person that they want to be. And they have the tools and resources that allow them to execute on that vision.
Speaker #0
I think that's great because I think when I think about Masogi, you know, the idea is something hard and that is a different approach to something hard, right? Explaining all that to a five-year-old, I have a six-year-old as we've talked about. Yeah. I don't envy that conversation. It's going to be very interesting, but I think that's it, right? It's that idea, that level of commitment of doing something that is really tough and bringing that to fruition. So I really appreciate you sharing. And one, lastly, I really appreciate you joining me today. I know they can find, much like my writing, your writing on your LinkedIn profile, finding us at journeywealth.com. And I also would like to close out that. In our next episode, you'll have Sean Ward joining yourself specifically to kind of touch on a little bit more of that planning and a little bit more of that finance aspect and how that all ties together for Sean's own personal life. So, again, thanks for joining me. Anything else you want to share before we close out?
Speaker #1
No, I appreciate the time today. I think it's, again, really cool to see the growth of the podcast. I'm excited about what we're building at Journey. And I know the conversation with Sean next week is going to be fantastic. What he's doing with small and mid-sized business owners is truly unique. Excited to give him the opportunity to share that and extract, you know, and let him talk about how he landed in a place where he is helping that group that has historically kind of been neglected by a lot of the other investment banking firms here in Northeast Ohio. So excited about that. Appreciate the time today, Adam. And yeah, let's keep going.
Speaker #0
Great. Appreciate it. Thank you. Join us next time.

Chapters

Introduction to The Journey Podcast
1sec
Recap of Previous Episode and Introduction of Michael Baker
15sec
Integrating the Four Pillars of Wellness
50sec
The Concept of Compounding Interest in Life
2min
Financial Wellness as a Foundation for Other Pillars
4min
The Connection Between Physical Health and Financial Success
7min
The Impact of Aging on Physical Health and Wealth
9min
Work-Life Balance and Family Engagement
10min
Social Isolation: A Crisis in Modern Society
17min
Transitioning from Work to Retirement and Finding Purpose
21min
Building a Holistic Planning Process with Clients
31min
Personal Reflections on the Four Pillars of Wellness
36min
Recommended Reading: 'A Gentleman in Moscow'
39min

Description

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Transcription

Speaker #0
Welcome to The Journey Podcast, a show dedicated to health, wealth, and happiness. Join us on the journey as we explore the world your health and wealth make possible. Welcome back to The Journey Podcast. Today, we are joined by my colleague, Michael Baker, for his second appearance. Michael, welcome back.
Speaker #1
Happy to be here.
Speaker #0
Great. Just thinking about this, the first thing that popped into my mind is like when the SNL, when someone gets the five hosting appearance jacket. So I'm sure you'll get to that pretty soon.
Speaker #1
Fantastic. I hope it's green and I get one every couple of years.
Speaker #0
A few thoughts that run through my head, but just kind of funny. Great. Well, I think what we're going to talk about today. is a little bit of where we left off on the first episode that we did in this podcast. And it's really kind of integrating those four pillars that we talk about at the firm and we've talked about with guests since then, spiritual, mental, physical, and financial. And really looking back to those guests and bringing forward some of the thoughts, perspectives that they provided and integrating that back into what we are doing at Journey when it comes to financial planning. and really financial wellness as a whole. The first thing I would really like to start off with, and this is going to be a little cliche, is a quote. Something that has really resonated with me from one of my favorite humans, Kevin Kelly. Kevin Kelly was the founder of Wired Magazine. If you remember that commercial, one of the most interesting humans in the world, first person hired on the internet, was cycling around in the 70s on a bicycle in Afghanistan. I mean... has done everything and anything. But I'm going to start with this quote because I think it's really going to set up the conversation for today. All the greatest prizes in life, in wealth, relationships, or knowledge come from the magic of compounding interest. By amplifying small, steady gains, all you need for abundance is to keep adding 1% more than you subtract on a regular basis. And I think really when you pull on the idea of compounding interest, for example, and then apply that to all of those pillars we talk about. And I think that really... sets the tone for the conversation. So I want to pivot that back and just tell me, what do you take from that quote? And how does that set up what we're going to talk today about what you do at the firm in that planning process and really financial wellness broadly? Yeah,
Speaker #1
absolutely. Well, first and foremost, I just want to say how fun it's been to see kind of the development of the podcast. I think the guests have been great and you've done a great job. So excited to be here and rehash some of that. But, you know, going back to the quote, when when we think about compounding interest, oftentimes we think of that exclusively related to money, but the reality is it doesn't matter what you do, whether it's time you spend with your kids, money that you put into an investment account, time you spend, you know, at church or, you know, working on your mental health with therapists or whatever it might be, investing the time and getting 1% better every day. The impact that that has on all aspects of your life over a long period of time is truly remarkable. People have a tendency to overestimate what they can do in a short period of time and significantly underestimate what they can do over a long period of time. And what we try to do is help people understand that you're not going to be able to make changes to many of the things that are really important to you over the next week. But if we can give you the tools and we can set a roadmap for you to feel comfortable and confident about your ability to make changes over a long period of time by making small decisions one day on to the next, the end result is going to be a place where you feel a lot better about where you are and a lot more confident about your ability to make those changes moving forward.
Speaker #0
Yeah, I think that is great. And I really do stick to that idea of 1%, getting 1% better every day. And anything you do usually leads to the outcome you're looking for. And I want to pull that back again, back to financial wellness. And really thinking about the guests we've had on the show, Brad and Drew and Sarah, touching on really the key components, for example, of mental health or physical health or spiritual health. You know, what foundationally is key for all of those things is financial wellness. And having a strong financial base. or foundation really kind of sets the tone and allows you to take a bigger leap, for example, into those other three key pillars. How do you think about that financial wellness piece in the clients you're working with? And what have you seen that having that strong foundation has it opened the door or allowed them to explore those other components?
Speaker #1
Yeah. Well, I think what's important is that all four pillars are inextricably linked, right? financial wellness is going to give you the means and the opportunity to invest in yourself, whether that be investing in personal training, you know, therapy, coaching, any number of different things. Having the financial means to be able to support those endeavors is really important. But the flip side to that is if you don't. take the time to invest your time, talent, and treasure into developing the person that you want to be, that will have an impact on your ability to generate the financial base that's going to support your ability to continue to develop in those areas. So I think it's really important, and we talk about this often at Journey, is that you can't look at one independently, but understanding that the investment in the other areas, will lead to continued growth from a financial perspective is really the differentiator and where we're seeing a lot of a lot of our clients start to really wrap their arms around and appreciate what it is that we're trying to bring to them.
Speaker #0
Yeah, and I want to I want to touch on one thing you just mentioned is the capability or the capacity for growth. When you start to invest in one of those or another, and then more importantly, the impact long term. We had Dr. Brad Patton on. He talked a lot about that shift from reactive medicine or health to proactive medicine or health, meaning let's look at where you are now. What can we get out in front of much earlier on? And when you take the lessons or some of the things he shared, you know, exercise, nutrition, you know, proactively going to see the doctor before something happens. How? How do you take those components and what he's talking about and then bring that specific piece of physical health into the financial wellness perspective? One thing I think about, of course, is insurance and that planning process. But could you kind of extrapolate that and go in a little bit more detail about that connection to those two and bringing it back to the financial wellness bucket?
Speaker #1
Yeah, you know, When we think about the impact of physical health on finances, there have been studies where they've looked at how does your physical health impact your ability to generate income, right? And one of the studies have showed that exercise, meaning roughly three days a week, leads to 6 to 10 percent higher income, right? So those who regularly exercise. are able to generate a significantly higher income, right, on average up to $6,500. And so when we think about, you know, encouraging folks to do that, right, they come to us and they think investing is a very specific thing, right? Wealth management, we're going to talk about investment, so on and so forth. But when we encourage them to invest their time in, you know, focusing on their health, that's going to translate into better mental health. You're going to show up and you're going to be more successful at work. And so when we think about the planning process, what we want to do is make sure that they're not just there to have a conversation around what their portfolio looks like. We're going to begin that financial planning process with getting an understanding of what's important to them. What are the components of their life that are going to drive the ability to achieve their goals? And then how do we help them think about using their means to support? those various aspects of their life. And by taking all of that into consideration through the planning process and getting them to focus on what's important, it shifts the conversation away from strictly financial and really helps them focus on, you know, what is their mission? What's their vision for the future? Not only invest on the financial side of things, but also investing their time and investing, you know, their talent and assisting those around them in getting better as well.
Speaker #0
Yeah, I think that's very thoughtful. One of the words you mentioned that is kind of family vision or personal vision. You know, however you want to think about that. I know that is incorporated in our plan at the firm, which is maybe a little bit unique or different. And it really makes me think about a book that you and I both love, Die With Zero by Bill Perkins. And there's a chart that I speak to and use. I know you do the same. And what it does is reflects on, you know, People's wealth as they get older. The idea being that if you do all the things in the plan and take the right steps, your wealth is going up. But as you get older, if you're not focused on that physical health bucket, the propensity or capacity and capability of the things you can do is kind of going the other way. So at some point, there's an inflection point together. But eventually, if you're not doing those things to invest in your physical health, it really starts to separate. And that gap between. Being able to take that incredible ski trip or, you know, go hiking in the mountains out west for seven days, right? You have the money and the capability in terms of financially, but you don't have it on the physical set. And how do you take that idea and translate that back to clients so that they understand, to your point originally, none of this is mutually exclusive?
Speaker #1
Yeah, I think, you know, again, oftentimes the conversation is so focused around saving and. building this nest egg that's going to support this idea of what retirement in the future might look like. But the reality is if you're not. able to do the things you want to do physically, whether that's taking trips, spending time with your grandkids and really engaging with them, whatever it looks like to you. If you're not physically capable of doing it, what's the purpose of saving all of this, right? You know, we talk about the difference between health span and lifespan. I would rather live 90 really good years than live 100 with the last 10 being miserable and not being able to do. I might have all the money in the world, but if I'm physically unable to do anything that allows me to enjoy my life, what's the point? So, you know, we always try to balance the now versus the future. And I'm certain we'll dive into that a little bit later. But really helping them understand when you structure what your goals and objectives are, don't just isolate that out into the future. It should be informed by the things that you can do today, which sort of. Goes back to what we talked about earlier. If you get 1% better, what can you do today that's going to have an impact and lead to the successes that you're looking for 20, 30 years from now?
Speaker #0
Yeah. And I want to touch on kind of a couple of the things that our other guests said, but I do want to hit on one item you just mentioned. And it's something I think a lot about. You know, I think in the advice space, in the planning space, to your point, you know, a lot of it is based on, you know. 10, 20, 30 years down the road, right? If someone that comes in, they're 35, they're 40. And you often in the advice space, we're talking about when you retire at 65 or 70, you know, what are you looking for? What do you want? Which is a critical component. But what I want to speak to is what you said about right now, right here. And something I think we do at the firm is No, you should take this trip or you should sign up for this class or you should do that. Spend the money now because you have the capacity to do it. And then we'll think about, you know, how you will be in the future. So can you tie those two together for me? Because I think that is thinking a little bit different.
Speaker #1
Yeah, well, to use a financial term, we talk about return on investment, right? So a dollar invested today, we expect a certain amount of return on that. And I don't think we apply that to the experiences that we create for ourselves in life, right? You and I both know what you're able to do now, whether it's climb a mountain, go on a safari, whatever it might be, you're likely to enjoy that more at 40 than you might at 65 when a lot of people think about retiring. So return on investment is not strictly financial, right? It's a return from a spiritual standpoint, from a mental health standpoint, from a physical standpoint. So that's really how I think about it is you need to invest today in being the person you want to be today, because if you do that, you're not going to look back at 65 and say, what if, right? Getting to 65 with a pile of money is going to give you the means to do a lot of things. But what did you give up along the way? And what return on investment are you going to get at 65 compared to what you might have gotten at 40?
Speaker #0
Yeah, that's that's great. Right. That term. ROI and what it really means. And, you know, people, when people think about return on investment, it's often how quick can I get that investment back? And I think that is a hard thing that I have seen is getting people to think about, you know, what you're putting in now, you know, may get a quick return, but at some point that ROI could be way down the road. And I think you just said it. There's an amazing paper titled by, I believe, Dunn, Gilbert, and Wilson. And the paper is, if money doesn't make you happy, then you're probably not spending it right. And my favorite piece from that, great title for a research paper, but what they talk about in that is experiential purchases and material purchase. And I think you just referenced the idea of experiential purchases, meaning the benefit and the impact. that someone gets from that as spending their capital, right? And how can you do it and what can you do it? And why I mentioned that is leaning into some of the things that I heard from both Drew and Sarah when it came to the emotional or mental health side. Meaning, you know, when you think about your mental health, it kind of a key component for us is thinking, for example, about social, right? The idea of those relationships. And we could cite the research over and over again, how important relationships are and what they mean to people. So could you touch on the idea that how we connect those dots for people, meaning, you know, when you think about spending on those trips or you think about, you know, your relationships and the social and emotional health aspect, how you're integrating that in. I know we talk a little bit about, you know, what wealth means to people. We touch on core values at the firm. We touch on that vision piece, which I think all of those anchor into things that they spoke about. Specifically that, hey, you have to have all these components dialed in when it comes to the relationships with yourself, your family, your friends. And that is an important part because if not, I know you have seen that and what it means to the financial wellness aspect.
Speaker #1
Yeah, I think it's really important. And I'll use an example for myself. When we think about what our family vision is, and we've recently been thinking about this a lot, and I've used this phrase several times already today, right? We want to invest our time, talent, and treasure to support our family, support our community. and invest in the things that we want to do to make sure that we're living the lives we believe we deserve and we want, right? And so as, you know, a family, what are we doing? How are we connecting with those around us? How are we setting time aside to make sure that we're investing in each other? We're investing in our community. We're investing in experiences. And so, you know, I think it's really important. When you think about that level of community, you know, I forget the statistic. I'll kick this one back to you. But the impact of social isolation, right? And we can be isolated when we're surrounded by people. I find a lot of people isolate themselves in their work, right? So you can go to work every day and you can make all the money in the world and buy all. Quantitative metrics can be super successful. But while your bank account might be off the charts. Your happiness isn't even hitting the chart, right? And so when we think about making sure people are engaged, it starts with understanding what's important to them and what they're doing to make sure that they're engaged on that. I would be curious when you see people that are failing to connect with others, how do you see that factor into their financial life?
Speaker #0
Yeah, I mean, one, I'll go back to the you mentioned about stats. I do love stats. Social isolation and loneliness. This is recent data coming from the Surgeon General who has actually put out a, you know, for a broader term, a crisis when it comes to isolation and loneliness within the United States. And I think I may have mentioned this in our conversation with Brad, but it's isolation and loneliness is the equivalent of six drinks a day or 15 cigarettes in terms of the impact to your physical health, which is just shocking when you think about it. And you really, you know. put that into perspective. So bringing that piece back 100% in terms of the impact of relationships. We know, for example, humans are the most social creatures on this planet. There's only like three other animals that create complex social environments as us. I think it's naked mole rats, termites. And some other insect, some weird piece of it. So, of course, that is a huge component. And I think you see that in the way people do. As a coach who works with executives and a lot of entrepreneurs and business owners, you and I both know the time it takes to get those businesses off the ground, grow them, and the work that goes into it. I mean, the hours, the commitment. Commitment and the stress is off the charts. The same with C-suite executives. I came from a world in terms of sales where you have people on the road 40, 50 weeks a year. And that distance. Disconnect from that community and the relationships they have is huge. And what do they do with that isolation? Meaning those relationships become fractured. So how are they trying to find connection, right? They may be doing that through spending habits, buying material goods or possessions to kind of fill a certain void. It could be fractured relationships with family, right? Like you and I know statistically when it comes to legacy planning by the second generation, and we may have mentioned this in the first conversation. You know, by the second generation, 70% of family wealth goes away. By the third generation, 90%. What's really interesting about that is the reason that happens is 85% of it is driven by communication or lack thereof. Back to that relationship piece. So when you look at it, it's fractured across the board, right? You know, for example, and Sarah and I mentioned this and we had a conversation on it. So I just want to kind of pull some of the pieces she specifically spoke to. But, you know, divorce over the age of 50 has doubled the last 20 years and expected to triple by 2030. When they started to look at that data, a lot of that is. disconnect in those relationships and also kind of some of the spiritual components about purpose and why that drew talked about. So I think to your point, you know, what, what I have seen, and I think what we see at the firm is of those four pillars, like at some point when one of those is fractured and specifically we're talking about relationships, it completely drips into the financial wellness bucket and all the things that drive that home. And I would, again, throw it back to you because you are the head of experience and planning at the firm. You see this on a daily basis, not only at this firm, but in your previous career. So love to hear just one specific story that you could share where you have seen, you know, I'd love to see the positive one and the negative one, if you wouldn't mind.
Speaker #1
Yeah, getting specific on the spot. That may be tough. But I think what I see. What I see often is you have these business owners that have invested 30, 40 years in developing a business, and they've been successful at doing that by all financial metrics, right? And what they've failed to do is invest in their family, invest in their community. And this isn't always the case, but we see it often because the work that it takes to be successful from a business standpoint is so significant. And, you know... They come to us, they're ready to sell a business, and they don't know what's next, right? So we talk about retirement and people suddenly lose their purpose, right? And so what we ideally seek to do, and I think this is what's really unique about what we're doing at Journey, is what we're seeking to do is help people not just think of it as retirement, but sort of graduating to the next phase of life. Where do you find purpose? How do you prepare for it? Right. And what tools and resources can we place around you to make that transition easier for you? And, you know, I kind of want to go back to a little bit of what you were talking about. I think what's really interesting is that we're seeing generational shifts. The younger generations are much more focused on something called work life balance. Now, you and I have talked about this in the past. Work life balance is an interesting thing. I think it's somewhat of a fallacy. But you see. Generally speaking, the younger generation values PTO, values the ability to have flexibility where they work, what time they work, so on and so forth. But we've also seen an increase in two-income households, right? What are the implications there as we think about engagement with children and the responsibilities of mothers and fathers and how they're engaging with their children with the various activities? And that all has implications from a financial standpoint. Right. But I think what we're seeing is those that lean into what they value are finding ways to support those things. Whereas if they strictly focus on putting food on the table, going back to a 1950s sort of mentality. they lose that connection with their family. And I see all too often the fathers specifically trying to make up for lost time with children that are busy raising their own kids, right? And so you see it try to manifest into grandchildren, things like that. So I think it's really important. And this is one of the things we noticed is you can't just think about the future. You need to identify what's important and invest in it today because you can't get the time back. You can always make the next dollar, but there's nothing you can do to bring back yesterday. And if I don't take the time to go watch my kid play soccer because I need to take a meeting with a prospective client, maybe the client signs with Journey, maybe the client doesn't. But my son did have a game and I'll never be able to see that. So I think, again, when we think about clients and we think about the ways that. We're seeing the generations change. We're trying to change along with them and give them the tools and the resources to make sure that they're truly invested in themselves and their family.
Speaker #0
That's great. I think that's a wonderful example. I feel that way. I think we had like five lacrosse games, two baseball games and sports pictures last weekend while my wife was working, actually. But I want to. pull on two of those components. One, what you said about the tools and resources, and specifically, when you think about all the clients you're working with, you know, how are you presenting those tools and resources to them? And how are you having that conversation and saying, from our planning process, of course, we're going to hit on all the key components, cash flow and, you know, return and investment allocation and making sure all the I's are dotted and the T's are crossed on your... trusts and will, but talk to me about some of those other tools and how you're integrating that into the planning process. Because I think that is the theme that I've heard from the guests we have had, you know, on the last few shows, what we talked about the first time is really surrounding those people with those tools and integrating that, like truly integrating that into the conversation and the planning process.
Speaker #1
I think that's what's fun about what we're doing, right? I would say we're midstream on... making some fundamental shifts to the way that we engage with clients to make sure that they understand all the ways that we can bring value to the relationship. But to answer your question specifically, it all really starts in the beginning of the planning process, right? So rather than diving into the quantitative side of things and getting an understanding, that's obviously important. But we ask clients to go through a process where they communicate what are the values that are important to you. How do you define wealth? And what is your family vision statement, right? And when we understand those things. We can then go into a data gathering mode where we understand what the quantitative side looks like, but we can also communicate to them that part of the process, part of the planning engagement, is how do we align what you told us from a qualitative standpoint? How do we take your family vision, your family values, and make sure that when you are saving or spending, You're doing so in alignment with the things that you said are important, because ultimately what we find is oftentimes people can they can identify values, they can identify vision and mission. But then the actions that they're taking aren't necessarily aligned with that. And so our job in the planning process is to align the vision with the financial side of things and then provide. you know, serve as an accountability partner for our clients. Say, you said this was important to you, right? Just checking in. Did you do X, Y, and Z that we talked about? What was the outcome of that? Do we need to lean more in there? Or are you struggling with that? You know, Adam works with our team. He's the head of coaching and development. Would it make sense to have a conversation with Adam and lean into exploring why this is difficult for you. Or, you know, we have strategic partners like Brad, like Sarah, where we can say, you know, you're struggling from a health standpoint, you're struggling from a mental wellness standpoint. Do you need to talk to somebody about that, making those introductions? So incorporating all of that into a process, right? And focusing on the process as opposed to the product is really, really important. So we Focus on that process, make sure people are engaged, serve as an accountability partner, and provide resources as appropriate.
Speaker #0
Yeah, I think that is really thoughtful. I think you've segued into one of the things I wanted to talk about with the words you used, and that's action. You know, one of the pieces of the plan is actually a pure takeaway action plan. And I think when you think about an action plan in a broader financial blueprint plan sense, it's really the— Hey, did you give us the documentation? We want to look at your spending habits and your cash flows and your current investment statements. But I think when you use the word action, what I hear and I know what I see is that action plan. Meaning between now and our next review or conversation, the idea is you've mentioned you want a house up on Lake Michigan, for example. you know, between now and then, you know, we want that commitment. Are you looking at houses? Have you connected with the bank? Can we help you connect to the bank? You know, that's just one specific example. And I think that level of commitment and integrating that into the plan, because it is a little bit different, right? So if someone comes back to us in six to 12 months and says in our review, We check in, you know, did you take the steps we talked about? And for example, the examples you mentioned, did you hire the trainer? Did you, you know, work with the precision health doctor? Did you, you know, take. the trip you wanted to take. And between then and now, right, if there isn't that action, that momentum, that movement, you know, then we're thinking about where's the friction. Right? And to your point, that is back to that tools piece of, well, once we identify that friction of why you didn't take those steps, to your point. How can we help you do that? Is it you just didn't feel comfortable, right? And if that is true, how can we help you do that? Do you want to have a conversation? Can we help facilitate an introduction? Do we need to bring in one of our partners? The same when it comes to training or nutrition. Hey, have you made the changes we talked about because of the impact to your healthcare costs? So on and so forth. So just, you know, again, wrapping those tools together, I think, is the key piece in the planning perspective. And you mentioned this is something that is really now kind of ingrained in our DNA. Could you talk about a couple of those conversations you have had with clients and what that feedback has been like in presenting those ideas?
Speaker #1
Yeah, what's really interesting about it is, again, we want to work with clients that. understand and value what we do. But the other thing we understand is not everybody comes to us as this perfect fit for this four pillar approach, right? So it starts with educating them about the four pillars and, you know, thinking about what we're here to talk about today, which is financial wellness, how we're defining that. Financial wellness is not just getting to the end of the rainbow with the largest pot of money, right? And so what's nice about the conversation is when you start to lay out what those four pillars are and how they interact with each other. It opens up the dialogue. It makes people feel more comfortable talking about things that, you know, in a prior life where most of what I did was strictly financial, they weren't willing to talk about, they weren't willing to lean into and share why it's important to them. And so, you know, when we can start the conversation, even before the point of them becoming a client, when you can start the conversation with someone telling. We're a multifamily office dedicated and surrounding the needs of our clients, but part of that is investing in the physical wellness, the mental wellness, and the spiritual wellness. What they don't do is they don't ask about all the ways we can help them financially, but they are leaning into, tell me more about that. Tell me, how are you working with clients on their mental wellness or their spiritual wellness or physical wellness? And that's where we have the opportunity to say, you know. We work with Dr. Brad. Precision medicine is something that he's sort of leading the charge on here in Northeast Ohio. You know, we have a partnership with Sarah Saunders. She does a great job working with families that have been through trauma and things of that nature. Right. And as people start to understand all the different ways we can work with them and support the needs, not only that they personally have, but that their family has, it opens up the conversation. And when we. get back to having a conversation about money, they're in a place where they're ready to place it in the context of that holistic wellness that we really focus on. And that's what's been really fun is, you know, being able to take a different approach while having sort of the traditional wealth management firm in the background that we can use as a tool, as a resource. to allow people to do the things that they say are important to them.
Speaker #0
Yeah, I think that's really thoughtful. And one question I do want to ask you is you have a long background in this business in terms of financial advice and planning. And joining the firm here at Journey, you and I work pretty closely. Would love to hear, you know, based upon your background and time in this industry and now coming on board journey and integrating a lot of these components. And you mentioned in our conversation, you know, your family specifically and how you're bringing this home. I would love for you to just talk a little bit more about how this approach has now kind of, for you, transitioned into your own personal world and what that kind of has done in terms of your personal and professional approach.
Speaker #1
Yeah, I mean, I'll be candid with you. It's life-changing. I was fortunate to work with a number of members of the team at a prior firm. So I knew that the people that I was coming to work with at Journey were the type of people that I wanted to work with. And I think, again, that goes back to the isolation, right? I'm invested in work because I enjoy what I do. I enjoy the people that I do it with. And I believe in what we're trying to do to change the industry for the better. But, you know, thinking about the four pillars of wellness, right? Getting my family engaged, right? So we've joined the gym. We go to the gym together, right? My wife and I are having conversations. What should our values be? How do we communicate those values to our children? How do we deal with stressful situations, whether that's around family dynamic, financial dynamics, whatever it might be? It is equipping me with the tools to really lean into those and make sure that I'm investing in them. In my family. And it's it's interesting because, you know, my wife has been through some of the exercises now and she sort of laughs just like this is hard. I'm like, it is hard. And that's that should tell you something. Right. And so I know there's value. I see it. I see the way that it impacts our family. I see the way that it impacts the clients that we're fortunate enough to get to work with. But I also see the excitement. at Journey and what we're building and what the future is going to look like. And I know that my ability to be a part of that is a core part of feeling good, building the happiness and, you know, living the life that I want to live.
Speaker #0
And that's, that's wonderful. I mean, that's the stuff that to your point gets me excited every day is one thing TJ talked about, for example, when he was on is, you know, the idea of like excited to get up, excited to show to work, the people we work with. And when a lot of those things are aligned, you know, the outcome with all of our clients is really dialed in. So to hear that, and I appreciate you sharing it because it does resonate kind of across the board. Again. And the next question I had is, you know, again, kind of tying some of that into now as someone with the expertise in planning that you do have or the insight in planning. What is your favorite part now of the planning process when you take these tools and these pillars and bring them into what you're doing versus maybe 10, 15 years ago?
Speaker #1
Yeah, well, it starts with it starts with accuracy, right? We have to get the quantitative side of things correct, right? But what's different about it and what I enjoy most now is the context that we can place around that. Right. So the ability to have a client say, I want to do this. Historically, the answer was, yes, you can or no, you can't. And, you know, it revolved around Monte Carlo scores. And now it's really I can look at a Monte Carlo score and say, OK, here's the problem. Here are different levers you can pull, but we don't want to sell out. today, you know, in exchange for some future that we may never have, right? The reality is tomorrow is not promised. And so, again, the ability to serve as that accountability partner and say, hey, you said this was important to you. Guess what? Your plan is still fine, right? We're fortunate enough to work with people that generally speaking, the math equation is solved. But what isn't necessarily solved is they're not doing the things they say they want to do. They haven't reached alignment from a... spiritual standpoint, from a physical standpoint, mental standpoint, right? And so leveraging our team and the expertise that we have from financial planning standpoints and executing from an investment standpoint allows us to decouple, not decouple, but focus less on that side or more appropriately get people to understand this is a tool. This is one resource, right? We've got you from a financial standpoint. We're asking you, rather than focusing on that next dollar, focus on the things you said are important. And the clients are responding really well to that. And it's leading to some really rewarding conversations, both for them, but also for us. And that's a win.
Speaker #0
That's great. I mean, to be able for that to be the impact you have every day with each and every client, I think, is truly living your authentic self on top of it. And using that term authentic self, I have two questions I want to ask you. I know you're an avid reader. So when you're thinking about books you have been tapping into lately or maybe sharing with clients, is there one we can leave for the audience that you really love that tie together some of these themes we've talked about and what our past guests have reflected upon?
Speaker #1
Yes. And it has very little to do with our profession. It has very little to do with the conversation. But. But maybe that's not true. So recently, a gentleman in Moscow has come out as a show, and my wife and I have been watching that. And it follows this path of a person that's confined to a Russian hotel. And if he leaves, he'll be killed by the Russian government. And following along on that journey of someone that's confined, right? But what he doesn't do is he's not isolated because he engages with the people around him. Much of his wealth has been stripped away from him, but he is not poor because he understands they can take away his freedom, but they can't take away his happiness. Right. They can't take away his ability to enjoy the life that he can create for himself. So I know it's one of my favorite all time books. Amor Tolles is the author. I know TJ loves it as well. It's something that I know he sent a number of clients. But. It's been fun to kind of watch that revisit the book itself. So that's one I would encourage anybody to read because it's educational, but it's also just a blast to read. You can't put it down. Comical and form informational. Amazing.
Speaker #0
That's great. Thank you for sharing the other one. And you've used this term just now. Yeah. The word create. And what I want to do is tie together. The last three, four guests we have had, the conversation you have had today, what we are doing at Journey. And what I really believe is we are creating a place in a community that is different and or differentiated. And giving people a new approach and allowing them to live that life that they want to live. So when I think about Create, I'm going to think about the rest of this year. And a term I've said over and over at the end for each of our guests, Masogi came from one of my favorite books, why I mentioned it, The Comfort Crisis. What are you creating for yourself through the end of this year? Or what is your Masogi? What are you creating as, hey, this is my big, hard thing as we think about that?
Speaker #1
Yeah, so we've talked about it already. My wife and I are in the process of sort of laying out what is our vision, what is our mission, what are our values. And what are we going to do to invest in those? And I think, you know, when we get to a place where we feel really comfortable with that, finding a way to communicate that to an 11-year-old and a soon-to-be five-year-old, right, that presents its own challenge. But what I know is if we are able to be clear about what our purpose is and we're able to communicate what our values are, we're going to have children that approach the world in a way that... allows them to do the things that they find valuable, right? You talked about how money seems to disappear from one generation to the next, and that comes down to communication. We're focused on raising children. That's the stage of life that we're in. Everything we do from the time we leave seems to revolve around a child going to one place or another. But what's really important to us is making sure they understand what's important to us, what kind of people we want to be. And that they have the ability to think for themselves, extract what they want from what we say, but have a clear vision for the kind of person that they want to be. And they have the tools and resources that allow them to execute on that vision.
Speaker #0
I think that's great because I think when I think about Masogi, you know, the idea is something hard and that is a different approach to something hard, right? Explaining all that to a five-year-old, I have a six-year-old as we've talked about. Yeah. I don't envy that conversation. It's going to be very interesting, but I think that's it, right? It's that idea, that level of commitment of doing something that is really tough and bringing that to fruition. So I really appreciate you sharing. And one, lastly, I really appreciate you joining me today. I know they can find, much like my writing, your writing on your LinkedIn profile, finding us at journeywealth.com. And I also would like to close out that. In our next episode, you'll have Sean Ward joining yourself specifically to kind of touch on a little bit more of that planning and a little bit more of that finance aspect and how that all ties together for Sean's own personal life. So, again, thanks for joining me. Anything else you want to share before we close out?
Speaker #1
No, I appreciate the time today. I think it's, again, really cool to see the growth of the podcast. I'm excited about what we're building at Journey. And I know the conversation with Sean next week is going to be fantastic. What he's doing with small and mid-sized business owners is truly unique. Excited to give him the opportunity to share that and extract, you know, and let him talk about how he landed in a place where he is helping that group that has historically kind of been neglected by a lot of the other investment banking firms here in Northeast Ohio. So excited about that. Appreciate the time today, Adam. And yeah, let's keep going.
Speaker #0
Great. Appreciate it. Thank you. Join us next time.

Chapters

Introduction to The Journey Podcast
1sec
Recap of Previous Episode and Introduction of Michael Baker
15sec
Integrating the Four Pillars of Wellness
50sec
The Concept of Compounding Interest in Life
2min
Financial Wellness as a Foundation for Other Pillars
4min
The Connection Between Physical Health and Financial Success
7min
The Impact of Aging on Physical Health and Wealth
9min
Work-Life Balance and Family Engagement
10min
Social Isolation: A Crisis in Modern Society
17min
Transitioning from Work to Retirement and Finding Purpose
21min
Building a Holistic Planning Process with Clients
31min
Personal Reflections on the Four Pillars of Wellness
36min
Recommended Reading: 'A Gentleman in Moscow'
39min

Embed

Introduction to The Journey Podcast

1sec

Recap of Previous Episode and Introduction of Michael Baker

15sec

Integrating the Four Pillars of Wellness

50sec

The Concept of Compounding Interest in Life

2min

Financial Wellness as a Foundation for Other Pillars

4min

The Connection Between Physical Health and Financial Success

7min

The Impact of Aging on Physical Health and Wealth

9min

Work-Life Balance and Family Engagement

10min

Social Isolation: A Crisis in Modern Society

17min

Transitioning from Work to Retirement and Finding Purpose

21min

Building a Holistic Planning Process with Clients

31min

Personal Reflections on the Four Pillars of Wellness

36min

Introduction to The Journey Podcast

1sec

Recap of Previous Episode and Introduction of Michael Baker

15sec

Integrating the Four Pillars of Wellness

50sec

The Concept of Compounding Interest in Life

2min

Financial Wellness as a Foundation for Other Pillars

4min

The Connection Between Physical Health and Financial Success

7min

The Impact of Aging on Physical Health and Wealth

9min

Work-Life Balance and Family Engagement

10min

Social Isolation: A Crisis in Modern Society

17min

Transitioning from Work to Retirement and Finding Purpose

21min

Building a Holistic Planning Process with Clients

31min

Personal Reflections on the Four Pillars of Wellness

36min

Chapters

Introduction to The Journey Podcast

Recap of Previous Episode and Introduction of Michael Baker

Integrating the Four Pillars of Wellness

The Concept of Compounding Interest in Life

Financial Wellness as a Foundation for Other Pillars

The Connection Between Physical Health and Financial Success

The Impact of Aging on Physical Health and Wealth

Work-Life Balance and Family Engagement

Social Isolation: A Crisis in Modern Society

Transitioning from Work to Retirement and Finding Purpose

Building a Holistic Planning Process with Clients

Personal Reflections on the Four Pillars of Wellness

Recommended Reading: 'A Gentleman in Moscow'

Chapters

Introduction to The Journey Podcast

Recap of Previous Episode and Introduction of Michael Baker

Integrating the Four Pillars of Wellness

The Concept of Compounding Interest in Life

Financial Wellness as a Foundation for Other Pillars

The Connection Between Physical Health and Financial Success

The Impact of Aging on Physical Health and Wealth

Work-Life Balance and Family Engagement

Social Isolation: A Crisis in Modern Society

Transitioning from Work to Retirement and Finding Purpose

Building a Holistic Planning Process with Clients

Personal Reflections on the Four Pillars of Wellness

Recommended Reading: 'A Gentleman in Moscow'

Chapters

Introduction to The Journey Podcast

Recap of Previous Episode and Introduction of Michael Baker

Integrating the Four Pillars of Wellness

The Concept of Compounding Interest in Life

Financial Wellness as a Foundation for Other Pillars

The Connection Between Physical Health and Financial Success

The Impact of Aging on Physical Health and Wealth

Work-Life Balance and Family Engagement

Social Isolation: A Crisis in Modern Society

Transitioning from Work to Retirement and Finding Purpose

Building a Holistic Planning Process with Clients

Personal Reflections on the Four Pillars of Wellness

Recommended Reading: 'A Gentleman in Moscow'

Chapters

Introduction to The Journey Podcast

Recap of Previous Episode and Introduction of Michael Baker

Integrating the Four Pillars of Wellness

The Concept of Compounding Interest in Life

Financial Wellness as a Foundation for Other Pillars

The Connection Between Physical Health and Financial Success

The Impact of Aging on Physical Health and Wealth

Work-Life Balance and Family Engagement

Social Isolation: A Crisis in Modern Society

Transitioning from Work to Retirement and Finding Purpose

Building a Holistic Planning Process with Clients

Personal Reflections on the Four Pillars of Wellness

Recommended Reading: 'A Gentleman in Moscow'