Speaker #0Hi, welcome to The Pulse, the podcast where we explore the heartbeat of life and work. I'm Julie, your host, and I'm thrilled to have you join me on this journey. Every two weeks, I will bring you a regular dose of inspiration, practical tips, and regular stories about personal development, wellness, and career growth. Whether you're looking for motivation, fresh perspective or just a reminder that you're not alone, you are in the right place. So welcome and let's dive in. Hi, good morning. So today we are on a new episode as usual and I had something in mind which was derailed so I ended up we are actually in the morning the episodes supposed to come out in an hour and I decided to do something different based on what I've seen lately and so it just didn't feel good to just talk about productivity to be honest I also feel like at the moment I'm losing a bit of my organization skills personally so I decided to kind of switch and I'll still do the episodes an episode on productivity and how to find to organize ourselves, etc. But I have decided to do an episode that, for me, in the current context of what we're facing in the world of corporate, and I think also startup, to be honest, I felt like it was an important topic to talk about and to discuss what to do. So basically, just to explain a little bit what I have in mind is whenever we are facing, you know, economical difficulties in some industries or... We see also the change with AI. We see a lot of people that are getting laid off. And this is definitely something that is very scary. And if you don't get laid off, you might be reshuffled and the organization might be in a different setup. And you might end up with a completely new job. And at the end of the day, those type of changes, it's not a change that you pick in a way. It's given to you or like you end up being like. impacted by it and it's not planned and those moments can be very very tough and you have to try to figure it out and balance and can be stressful and can be very emotional and I myself in some level have had those kind of situation before where all of a sudden there is a new organization and we tell you okay now your job was a before now it's gonna be and you're like but this is in a way not what I had planned to do but here you go you have to do this new job or you are in a position potentially that you don't like that you are feel stressed or you do not enjoy at all or you struggle with the boss or whatever and you have some time to make a very quick change and a very quick mood because it's too difficult to handle and to be in that situation doesn't matter what it is at the end of the day those moments become very emotional and very difficult to handle so I wanted to do to give you like in this episode a bit of like tips and tricks that I learned along the way I'm not saying it's easy at all because it's as I said very emotional very difficult very um it's it's very hard but there are based on what I've learned over the years and also my mistakes or the way I handle some situations I learned that there is a few things you can put in place in order to to help you deal with a better way be more prepared and have some like kind of plan around it or manage that is not automatically like that stay rational in the current context that you're in so let's start right away and I'll explain it's very it's maybe a bit difficult and a bit rough because I don't want to be insensitive I actually want to be so sensitive that I may struggle with some words of how I want to express it but for me it was important that no matter what I talk about it and I bring that topic up. Because in this current context, I feel like a lot of people are scared. A lot of people are worried. And I also do get it. And I also do sometimes worry about the future. So being prepared or having some thoughts can help do that. So I just want to bring some of the ideas I have in mind. And then please let me know if there is another episode. Of course, this is coming out from my perspective. But I can definitely do some follow-ups on that topic later. Most likely over the years, things are going to change. Some new things are going to come in mind. But yeah, we're in 2026. This is definitely based on the current situation. And I just want to bring it forward. So let's talk. My intro is already way too long. So let's get there. So basically, if you are in a situation or if anyone is in a situation of losing their job or being part of a... of a change or part of a layoff overall. I think the first impact is that you end up with no job. So financially, you have a big concern of finding a new job in order to sustain yourself financially. And what I tell a few of my friends that are either impacted by it or have been impacted by it is, based on everything that I've learned, I've seen it before for me, where I was not in an official layoff, but I was sometimes asked to change job or I was in a situation that didn't feel comfortable. I was really unhappy in some positions. And every single time I felt like I can't move or I can't or have to take another job or have to find something quick, whatever it is, because of the fact that there is this financial burden. And so what I kind of started to tell or to figure out is that you can kind of create that matches of if you're in a current job. what you can do, how long you can sustain it, depending on the scenarios. So let me explain. If you're in a job that you like, you're in a bad situation, you want to keep going. If you are dealing with a job that you don't like, how long can you stay in that job until you feel like this is not acceptable, I can't do it anymore? It's kind of like a question you have to answer for yourself. And in that context, what would be the other options in order to not be there? anymore. So giving you the idea, you are today in a job that you don't like, how long can you sustain it until you start looking for a job is the first question. Then how long when you're looking for a job, like let's say you're looking for the same role that you're currently having, or a better role if you're looking for the better role, or how long do you look for that one? And if you don't get it, How long are you then going to say, okay, now I'm not going to look at that role anymore. I'm going to look at one lower because clearly I'm not able to get the position. So let's say you're like me, I'm currently a senior project manager. I would look at first roles potentially either as team lead or senior project managers. How long do I look into that role until I say, okay, I'm not finding anything, but I'm really unhappy in my job. Let's say, for example, then by when do I start looking at project manager role? And then if I don't get that one because there is too much people or I want to stay in a specific industry again, how long until I look for another industry or how long do I take even like a further pick up? But I'd rather change than to stay in what I have that is not good, for example. So this is the idea of like you're going to kind of create a decision tree in advance so that by the time you are in the position of being potentially unhappy, then you don't have to. to make an emotional decision of like, I have to leave tomorrow no matter what, you can say, okay, based on what I had planned, I had X amount of months. You, of course, might evolve that amount of months to say, okay, I can still sustain, I don't know, six months, one year to do that role, however it is. But having this into a perspective is helping you not being emotional to say, I'm struggling with my boss, for example, or the project that I'm doing is not great, and I can't handle it anymore. It's like... how long can you accept to do it and under what conditions? So it could also be in regards to pay, you know, like how much time can I sustain not having an income, right? And based on that, during that time, I may say, let's say I have one year of income saved or have like one year, like sometimes like depending on the country you have, either you're going to have it saved or you're going to have the government who will support you. So let's say the government supports you for a year. Like how long are you looking at position in your level if you lose your job? And then how long do you look at the position in the level below? Because you really want a job at the end of that one year or you want a job. Maybe you don't feel comfortable being unemployed, let's say. So already, like you said, from day one, I'm already going to go for the position below the one I have because I'd rather have a job than not have a job at all. So depending on that, you will adapt that mattress. but having it in mind and not creating it out of... fear on the get-go but always having it can help you be prepared for that moment and being like rational it's like okay I said like now I really just want to have a job tomorrow but I mean if I look at the mattress that I made in the moments that felt comfortable this is what I gave to myself and this is the reason why I gave it to myself let's say you may say okay like I would rather wait six months of unemployment and look for that six months in term of like a senior man you project manager position if I take again my example but then during that period like because for me it's important potentially to have the same pay or to maybe it's related to location it's like the most important for me is to stay in city x and in that case like I would rather you know after three months already look at job below but at least stay in that city or like do something different so having really this kind of like full back plan or this idea of what are your cratia. and not getting or taking the next job without like just out of emotions overall can help you feel like make the whole situation rational and usually what I've seen is that you're going to have multiple criterias the first one you're going to have is going to be for sure financial the second one you're going to have is potentially family or organization life organization The third one you're going to have. is most likely about your role in the company. So like based on what you were in your career plan. But at the end of the day, your career might not go first if you think rationally of what's the most important to you. But if you are just like feeling like I want the same thing as before because you're in an emotional moment, then you might think differently. So again, think of that mattress. And actually, you can also do it in a positive way. If you're looking to grow and you feel like you're stuck, You made... end up saying I'd rather take any positions or like may not think of what's that growth matrix looks like. So at the end of the day, it's creating this multiple balance of like, how or where can I go? What are my fallback plan that I've prepared for myself in terms of looking for positions? So as I said, for example, if you're a PM or a senior PM, how long do you look at senior PM before you go to look at project manager position or... Which industry would be the industry that can be feasible for you to work in? Or which city would you want to work in, for example, etc., etc.? So always think on that to help you prepare for an overall issue or layoff or a request to change roles overall. And the role you imagine you don't like it. So it's still very emotional to do because when you feel safe and the moment you are in, it might be very tricky. But I would really recommend to have this in mind. So that by the time you're struggling, then you don't have to put everything on the one emotion of like, you just lost your job. You need to find something else tomorrow or else you're going to struggle. The second part is I hear a lot of people, if you go on LinkedIn, it's all about like branding, And then you hear like you are basically your job title. is your current brand. But at the end of the day, if you get laid off or if you change roles, then that brand is changing along the way. And while I do understand this idea of branding, I think the most important first is to be clear on who you are, what you can do, and what are your skills that you can bring forward. Because you may want to brand yourself toward a certain type of positions, but with today and with AI. You don't know where that position is going to be in six months. You don't know like how long, like is this job going to exist long term at the end of the day? So the most important is to know what are your skills that you can bring forward. And there will be the skills that you're bringing forward today. There might be the one that you still bring tomorrow. If not, what are the skills that you can have in mind that can help you feel a bit safe or create a certain form of security? I explain to you. For example, I'm French, living in Germany, having a diploma from the US. So beyond project management, let's say tomorrow AI takes over project management, there is no need for project managers. What do I do with my life, right? First of all, there is my experience that I got. Maybe I can go into teaching, either English, either project management, or maybe there are other skills from what I learned of like... traveling, I don't know, you know, so you can think on that. Or maybe actually, I can on the side work on preparing for another job, which would be anything you could look at, like a sports teacher, you could look at being capable of running a little business like a bookstore. It could be many, many, many different things. And I'm struggling to have so many ideas. But you get it, right? It's not about the skills directly related to your current job. Because we don't know what our job will be, but there are some skills within your day-to-day, within your life, or within even your job that you've learned over the years. And that can create a new business if you need to. And this can be your fallback plan in some ways. I'm not saying that it's easy. If being, for example, an English teacher is not easy, you have to pass some exams, you have to go through a certain process. But this could be potentially a fallback scenario. Afterwards, are we going to need an English teacher forever? I don't know as well. You never know how teaching will be in the long term, right? But at the moment, you still definitely need those people and you need to teach the kids, etc. So. This is one of my ideas, but maybe, as I said, you may have knowledge of corporate, you have knowledge maybe of startups, so you know about business in general, and maybe learning a little bit about how to run a business can be something where you may want to create something that is sustainable, that people are using. We know that coffee stores or like whatever else can be, I think sometimes like a lot of millennials are thinking about this as a... as a side hustle or as an idea for the future and to live corporate. I've heard a few people talk about this. But in general, having in mind what are the skills of what you have learned that could be transferable to another job long term. And it's not all about becoming coaches, about becoming a brand ambassador or whatever, because at the end of the day, this is still a limited market and not everyone can be a coach. But in general, I think there are other things that we can do and that you can prepare yourself for this. And you may not think you have more skills, but really it's about taking the time outside again in a moment where you feel safe to think, what are my fallback plan? If tomorrow there is no more job incorporate in my field, what can I do? What are the options? I'll take another example that could be good. You know, it's like design. I know, unfortunately, a lot of those jobs might be replaced or AI is using all that knowledge and building and strengthening it, which means that it's less and less needed in terms of volume of people. So that might be scary and there is still need of those jobs. And I do believe that those jobs will still be needed. But if you feel scared that you will be redundant or that your job will be away. Then think about what are the other things that you can learn, that you have learned, that can be useful for a potential other job. So really here, it's thinking outside of the box, not just about your job. And as I said, for me, it's like I've thought about teaching English, teaching project management. I've also thought about what type of small business I could start if I wanted to. I mean, the coaching has come to my mind, but as I said, I see a lot of people doing it. So at the moment, it's not something that I would think to do. But there are multiple things that can become interesting and can be something that can bring value. And there are some jobs that will always be needed. So it's just about finding the right one for you. And again, it's not something that you have to do. It's just like a really backup plan. You feel like your field is completely gone at a certain period in time. And I truly hope that is not the case. And I don't want to be negative or scare you, but I think it's all about preparation up front that will help you be ready for that moment. The third thing that I would really advise is to look at your current skill, your current job, and where you are from. organization standpoint how are you set up and let me explain to you if you are a designer in a certain industry it might be difficult if that industry is struggling are you able to switch industry is the type of design you're doing something that can be transferable and i've seen i'm using design because i've seen a lot of challenges for example for a designer that is designing, I don't know, a car part to... be able to then start designing in fashion. It's a completely different ballgame. So I would expect that it's very hard for them to transition from one to the next. But it's not impossible, right? There are courses, there are things online that can prepare you for that. So really assessing your current skills and how much transferable to a different industry, how much reusable from one department to the next is important. And sometimes people are... meant to be in one career are meant to be in one path. And I'm not trying to tell you to switch. I know my career has been more of a generalist. I've worked in multiple departments. I've worked in multiple industries. I mean, I'm mainly in fashion, but I've worked also in other industry when I worked in the startup. But you still need to be able to prepare for that future of potentially an industry struggling. I see right now the automotive industry in Germany is really struggling. So having a plan B and knowing what are my skills and which fields I can work in might be very useful because potentially the field you're in is at the moment struggling. So what you can do here is first look at all your skills and really name all of them. and really thinks long-term. So even for me as project management, I would talk about communication skills. I would talk about organizational skills. I would talk about project management purely. I would also go into, well, I learned from all the fields. I have a certain knowledge base into play chain operation, finance, HR, etc. Try to put all those skills into a perspective. And then based on that, you have to try to organize them in terms of like, Which skills are specific to a certain industry and which skills can be used in any industry or which skills can be used in any department? So same thing, even if I said supply chain, am I having the knowledge of supply chain only in fashion or if that skills would be in a different industry, could I use the same knowledge that I have in that other industry or is it really specific to that industry? And based on that, it will give me that opportunity to potentially know where which direction is open, is still open to other areas, other industries, other opportunities, other departments as well. If you've done only, let's say you've worked only in IT and you're a tech person, you still have worked on other skills with other people. And maybe some of your IT skills might be more technical, but some others might be more also business-like. For example, I have a colleague that was working in IT in a topic. and he'll be switching to the business side, but still for the IT topic and project management. And so in that sense, I mean, I haven't, I don't know him so well, so I'm not going to talk about the specific person. But in that sense, it seems like he's using his knowledge of IT in order to get a job on a different side of the business and growing his base and having that opportunity as well. So it's really that, it's thinking about what are my skills? Where can I use them and how can I use those skills? And really think outside of the box how far you can go into that point, because the further you can go, the better. Now you might feel, I'm so specific. I just know I have these one skills or I'm in this very specific field. So I don't know how this could evolve. And there are ways, of course, with training these days, online courses. You have so many platforms where you can get some certification. And if you do it now where you are safe, it's easier than if you try to do it in the future when you are struggling and you may be stressed and there is a lot, you have to look for a job or you have whatever case scenario. So whenever you are in a safe environment, take the time to really do that assessment and try to understand what certificate I can get today to help me. And I know like... Sometimes we get too many diplomas, too many certificates. It's like too much, And I'm the first one who sometimes said to myself, I have too many certificates. But at the end, those certificates help me prove my skills. And sometimes when I'm in a field where I don't have the proof that I did some of the work, or like meaning that I have some skills in it, then having that extra certificate can be good. I explained to you, I was at some point looking for a job. and someone, and I was looking at the direction of IT. And I have project management experience. I've worked with a lot of IT colleagues. So if I were to do project management in IT, well, I don't need to know everything about IT. But so I felt like I had enough knowledge to do project management in IT. But the first question I was asked was, do you have SAP background or have you worked with SAP before, for example? And I said, well, I mean, I worked with people who worked on SAP. Did I work directly on SAP? No. Then maybe getting a certification in SAP will prove that I have, first of all, learned about SAP and that I have now the potential answer to people if the expectation is to have SAP knowledge. Then I have it because I have the certificate, because potentially the job is not going to give me that opportunity to work further than what I've done so far. And this is one example, right? And then it's a decision of when I do this certification, what does it make sense? And again, it's not about just getting more and more certification, but if I want to keep a door open, maybe having that in the back burner can be a good idea if all of a sudden I see... that some fields are going into creating a more strengthened than others then maybe then this is the time to do the certification in order to be ready and to switch toward that field or maybe I'm interested in that field I want to go into and actually I would say like for me I'm definitely interested at some point to to learn more about the IT side so this is something I'm also looking in too, but in general, having those in mind that... can be helpful. I have a friend as well. He was in marketing and he wanted to go into digital marketing and they said, well, we don't see on your CV you have digital marketing experience. He went to get a certification. I was like, okay, now you see I have digital marketing experience of some sorts. I have a certification. I've trained myself in it. And therefore I feel confident that I can do it. And all of a sudden he had those opportunities coming his way. This is what I mean by it. It's not about just getting more and more and more certificates that you just keep it on the back burner. It's just to have in mind which are the certification or which are the skills that you can develop further, either if you wish to go that direction right now, or that you keep in mind that could be helpful in case a certain direction makes sense with your career, or if you have to move to a different part of the organization and you have to show that you are the right person for it. Right. So. It's finding the balance. I'm not telling you to get 20 certifications tomorrow because also it's important to learn from it and to really have the knowledge. But it's just to be prepared and to have that planned in mind. So as I said, I'm giving you the idea of IT, of marketing, but there are many, many other fields. You may say you want to get an official certification in English so that if you want to go into teaching, you have that already now. So that potentially by the time you're looking for a new job, if you lost your job and you're looking into that option, then you're not stressed of like, I need to get my certification in two weeks because or in the months because I need to find it tomorrow. I need to do whatever tomorrow and I cannot wait. So it's things to have in mind, not to do it in a stressful environment, but to every year kind of look at that skill panel, that overview and to say where you want to grow and what makes sense. for you to develop your skills in, in order to feel confidence that you have enough to move forward. For me, those are the three main points that come into my mind. And there are, of course, more things that you can do that are going to be more personal. Here I was trying to stay on the professional side, but one thing I haven't talked about is really also understanding financially. How long can you stay unemployed? Or how critical is this for you to stay in a job that you do not like? So let's say you're like me being in Germany. We have, of course, if you are being fired or if you lose your job or you're part of a layoff, then there is usually like some plan. You're given some financial support from the government for a certain period of time, things like this. And based on that, you have to understand for yourself financially. how ready I am. And you should always have a bit of backup. And I think there are some other podcasts and some other tools that explain to you more how much financial backup to have, but how much do you want to have as a backup for how many months in case the government is not supporting, if the government is supporting like how many extras just in case it's reduced, et cetera. So having all that into perspective is helping you, giving you a bit of an idea of a timeline and then Of course, financially, you need to understand if you have a family, like me, I have a dog to support. So what does the financial impact if tomorrow I lose my job? What happened or what are the situation? How long can I stay in the place that I'm in? Do I need to look for something else? Like if you have a partner, how long can the partner's financial budget can support you? What happens if you both lose your job? Whatever combination of a financial situation, I think it's always one of the major worries for people. So having this clearly in mind. So for me, I know that, okay, if I lose my job, I am in Germany, so I have some safety from the government. I don't need to pay for daycare for my dog anymore. My apartment might be a bit expensive because I'm in Stuttgart. Is there other options? How long, if I don't find a job, can I then have to leave? and then go back maybe to France. What other countries I can go into in order to find a job also is something to have in mind. Can you move your family if you have a family? And if you can move, which countries are the options or which financial situation it's going to be? Depending on your moment in life, it's going to be different. If you're in the moment of having your kids that are 10 years old, that you have your partner that is having a job in a certain location and that location cannot be moved, or if your partner is working fully remote, or maybe there is different options and different setups. Can you change city? Can you change country? Can you be in a different environment? Or do you have to stay in the town you're in? And also, this is where I would really, really highlight to be always aware of your surrounding. This is something I've seen a lot in Germany. There is beauty in the fact that a lot of the companies I've seen have their headquarters in the city where they were created, which is beautiful because then you look at those small towns and you see this big company being in a small town from a historical standpoint. It's great. I mean, Adidas and Puma in Erzogenaurach, Hugo Boss is in Metzingen. which are tiny towns that most likely you don't know about unless you work in one of those companies. But for example, Hugo Boss is near Stuttgart, Adidas, Puma, Anier and Nürnberg, still half an hour away, so it's manageable. But then how much job, what are the opportunities around those bigger cities, right? But if you're in a smaller town, in a smaller area, working on a very specific industry, most likely if that company fails, What happened? Or if that company is doing some layoff, what happened? How far away do you have to drive? Do you have to move because you can't manage this drive of being so far away? Also think today we had in the past, we had with COVID, we're able to work remote. And some people are living in very far away from their company. And today, a lot of companies are asking people to come back to the office. I see a lot of time, it's three days versus two days remote. And therefore, if you're living through three hours away because you used to work fully remote and now you have to come three times a week are you moving or are you doing this travel every day or are you finding another job where you are and where you are is there opportunity in your fields this is all the question that you have to have in mind up front again because usually the way i've seen it is that people are like companies are planning it and saying okay you've got six months to make a decision And Six months can be very short company-wide. And company-wise, it can be very difficult to handle if you've been in your role for so long, if you've been in your job for so long. And I think a lot of people are also attached to those amazing corporations. But at the end of the day, you have to be prepared that something may derail your plan of what you've put together. The same thing for me. If tomorrow they ask me to come back five days a week in the office, that five days of paying for daycare, it's a lot of extra cost for me. Can I afford it? If I can, great. If I cannot, how long can I deal with that extra cost? Or do I need to ask for a raise? Will they give me the raise? If they don't give me the raise, how do I manage? What is the plan? How long would I accept to work five days until I would want to go somewhere else? I'm giving you those examples. They're not happening at the moment, but you know, I have to have this in mind. And same thing is like if every company is asking for their five days, What are my plan, you know, to do? What are my options? And you have to think about your partner, your kids, your dog, or whomever in your surroundings. And I could go beyond, and I don't want to make it a negative episode, because here it's really about planning for the worst. But of course, we need to be hopeful for the best. But there might be some things that are really out of your control. Let's say tomorrow you have someone in your family that gets sick and you want to help. If tomorrow someone of my parents is unwell or something happened to someone in my family, I'm still far away. I'm still at the closest. I'm six hours. And so what does it look like? At the moment, I'm allowed to work 30 days per year from the EU, which allows me to go home and to also work remote from their place and to be able to see them more often. And if this changes, if tomorrow this is gone, then I just leave my holiday. Is this enough to see them, to feel connected to my family? etc, etc, etc. And I can go on with topics like this. But at the end of the day, if a position change, or if you are part of a layoff, or if the condition of your job are changing, you have also power to decide on what you do. But because those changes are happening to you without your decision in a way, so it's like it's given to you, you don't... Then it becomes emotional and hard. And that's where it's important to create that plan and to build that comfort for yourself. Yeah, as I said, I didn't want this episode to be too negative, but I wanted to ensure that we all think about what are my plans and what are my backup. And you don't have to spend your whole life thinking about it and being scared of being worried. But I would say do it every six months or so and understand, okay, what can I bring forward? Who am I? What is the point in my CV also? By the way, CV, always have it ready on the go. Don't wait a couple of years. like really keep on updating it on a regular basis. And that might sound like a lot, but at the end of the day, it's all preparation for the worst case, which you never hope will happen. And I hope for any of us that it will not happen. But if it does, then that will create a form of a bit of security of, okay, I have a plan. And I'm actually not lost at all. Because when you decide to change, it's usually very exciting. This is what something you wanted to do. But when you have to do a change because of negative circumstances, it's very hard to accept it and very hard to manage personally. So I think being prepared and having those plans can be highly supportive. So yeah, that was today's episode. I hope you liked it. I hope it's helping you or I hope if you're in the moment of struggling that you're able to take a breather and think about... those topics to help you balance and to help you reframe it. As I said, I've been in some form of cases before, but I know it's been hard for some people lately. So I wish everyone the best. I hope you're safe. I hope your job is safe at the moment. Thinking of everybody and wish you a very nice day and we talk very soon. Bye. And that's a wrap for today's episodes of The Pulse. If something resonated with you, I would love to hear about it. So drop me a message on Instagram, LinkedIn, or leave a review wherever you're listening. Your feedback fuels this community and I much appreciate it. Make sure to follow The Pulse on your favorite podcast platforms and on social media so you never miss an episode. And if you're craving for more, check out the show notes for links, resources, and ways to connect. Until next time, keep trusting your journey. Because growth happens one step at a time. See you soon. Bye.
