Hilary Duff-naissance, Wuthering Heights & Kristen Bell's ‘I Love My Husband (Who Hates Me)’ I House of Gossip | House of Gossip

Description

The girls saw "Wuthering Heights"… and the tears were flowing. Kelly Cutrone has a few choice words for Jay Manuel RE Americas’ Next Top Model documentary. Hilary Duff is reborn and my goodness she is killing it on the press circuit including a Call Her Daddy session PLUS Gazzer hath read a The Cut article entitled ‘I Love My Husband (Who Hates Me)’ which includes a case study on Kristen Bell & Dax Shepard's unique relationship.

The look of love

Recco of the week: Love Story

Follow the podcast @houseofgossippod and these gossip girls on insta: @soph_lyons & @clazzykabana

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Transcription

Speaker #0
Are you ready? We ride it's on We ride it's on This is House of Gossip's earliest recording ever, I won't tell you what time it is. But welcome along to House of Gossip, your weekly dose of book culture nourishment with myself, Clara Kavanagh, and you, Sophie Lyons. How are you getting on, girly?
Speaker #1
Me Me too I've got you, Lyons. Breakfast briefing for the girls.
Speaker #0
Woo woo I feel energised. I feel ready for the week. Ready for the weekend. Thank you so much for all your comments and DMs about our ANTM episode. We really enjoyed getting under the hood of it and talking about the toxic relationship that existed between ourselves as viewers and Tyrone Banks, the executive producer who said she had no production. controlled but also said she was the master editor it's not really my area executive producer across the screen i'm gonna start saying that in work when i do something wrong yeah it's not really my area it's hard for me to talk about it because it's not really my area but everyone's favorite pure guru kelly katrone from the hills and the city fame has chimed in in the meantime and i just wanted to make a quick little reference to it so she overlapped with jay manuel the jays and Nigel. for one season, 18 seasons. So like their last one after, and then they got fired. And then she went on to do from 18, seasons 18 to 22, or cycles 18 to 22. But she goes on Instagram this week. Side note, Jay never worked in the fashion industry. He worked at MAC Makeup Counter in Toronto.
Speaker #1
Sorry, I did read this.
Speaker #0
Yeah, Tyra boosted him. And how did he repay her? By writing a novel about her and the show, which nobody bought. And now he's trying to become relevant by being out there trashing her again. Maybe he will get a deal as a spokesperson for a spray tanning or filler. He was so incredibly rude to me on my first day on the show. He came up to me and said, welcome to the show. You are in the ejector seat, meaning anyone who sat in that seat, Andre, etc., was fired. Oddly enough, what happened to him at the end of that season? So I do love her honesty.
Speaker #1
I do too. I always liked it.
Speaker #0
Yeah, I don't know why she signed with Tyra though, but...
Speaker #1
I can analyze this.
Speaker #0
Okay.
Speaker #1
He obviously was scorned since cycle eight because he was like, I want to leave. And then he basically was imprisoned.
Speaker #0
Yes.
Speaker #1
And so he had to continue on. And you see these people come and go and he wanted to go, but they were like, you'll be blacklisted.
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
So he was basically stuck there.
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
And I think naturally as a human being, if someone new came in, who Callie Catrone is quite spicy. I'd say he was really like, oh, you don't know what you're in for.
Speaker #0
Yeah. And he's also had 18 cycles of trauma.
Speaker #1
Like a lot. Yeah. But I do like Kelly Catrone.
Speaker #0
I do. It's interesting.
Speaker #1
So it's sad they're not friends. They could have been a good calling him a makeup artist from Mac. That is a dig.
Speaker #0
Dig. So, yeah, enjoyed that during the week. OK, now, so what are you, is J'Adore you're testing from your week?
Speaker #1
I'm J'Adore a trip to the cinema that me and my good friend Clara made this weekend.
Speaker #0
Oh, a little excursion.
Speaker #1
Sorry, we're also wearing the same top half with our Sophie and Clara necklaces and a black long sleeve and hoops. We're such good friends. Clara and I went to see Wuthering Heights, which I thought it was amazing. I don't know too much about the literature behind it. I didn't know what I was going into. I don't read reviews beforehand. If you listen, you'll know I do not read reviews beforehand I want to have my own thought on it I thought it was brilliant. Spoiler alert at the end of this because I'll say something about one bit I thought was amazing. The set.
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
Wow.
Speaker #0
Oh my god.
Speaker #1
The set and the costumes were unbelievable.
Speaker #0
They told the story. They were like a character. Yeah.
Speaker #1
Oh my god and the detail. You kind of felt like you were in them when you were watching it. Yeah. Like when you were in the dirty house you were a bit like oh yeah And then in the other big house, which was stunning, but the environment not so much. I actually just listened to something and they called it sterile, which I thought was such a good word to describe it. Because it was stunning for your eyes, aesthetically. But the love wasn't the same there between Catherine and, what is he, a lord or whatever?
Speaker #0
Edgar.
Speaker #1
Wait, no, is that not Jacob Elordi's character?
Speaker #0
No, Edgar was... No, that's Heath Clegg.
Speaker #1
sorry about that Jacob Elordi as Edgar he's Heathcliff forgive me the sexual escapades when they get into the mid bit of the movie where they're just like having sex all the time in secret Whoa.
Speaker #0
Can I sound like a bit of a creep though?
Speaker #1
Go on.
Speaker #0
Just because Saltburn was so kind of out there with its sexual stuff, I definitely thought we'd see like a boob or something.
Speaker #1
No, I knew because it was two big stars, we wouldn't see it.
Speaker #0
Yeah, I felt like there was a little bit of a veil over it. I thought they might, just with all the press and everything, I thought it was going to be a bit more on the sexual side.
Speaker #1
I think it was without being graphic.
Speaker #0
Yeah, it was. It was in a different way.
Speaker #1
Like, you know the bit where she's masturbating?
Speaker #0
Yes, behind the rock.
Speaker #1
Plush my pearls. Yeah. And like at the start of the movie, you know, the noise that you think is, sounds like people having sex. That bit. You know the bit where they're in the barn thing?
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
And the two housekeepers come over and they use like horse equipment.
Speaker #0
Yeah, a bridle.
Speaker #1
A bridle. Yeah. Oh my God, that was hot. Sorry, it was just very sexual. I don't know if it was hot.
Speaker #0
And then it kind of got into all the kinky stuff with that Irish actress, Alison Oliver, as Isabella. She was great, I thought.
Speaker #1
Is Nellie the dog?
Speaker #0
No, Nellie was the housemate who interfered too much.
Speaker #1
Oh.
Speaker #0
You don't know anyone's names.
Speaker #1
The Isabella thing with the dog was like bonkers because it went so, like it started off as really like... you know, she's getting married to this lord and like there's loads of fog. Yeah, yeah. And then there's this girl in like this tea party dress pretending she's a dog.
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
With Heathcliff. So it kind of flip-flops from one side to the other, which is quite nice as a viewer. His Yorkshire accent.
Speaker #0
Mmm.
Speaker #1
Excellent. Yes,
Speaker #0
very good.
Speaker #1
He was really good with the accent. And this is the spoiler, the bit at the end.
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
Oh, I... burst out crying when he's like she's dead isn't she she's dead at that point and he's like next to her he's left and he's like be with me always take any form oh my god that was hard wasn't it and then i look over assuming clara's blubbering too and
Speaker #0
her face is dry and i was fully weeping and usually it's the other way around you'd say like a half a sentence to me and i'd start crying yeah and you were like oh god and then i and you were just like oh yeah bone dry i don't know what happened to me no it's not a problem it's fine the movie was very different to what i thought it was going to be and i just thought it was going to be a big like kink fest or something i was going in expecting you know that like new film with alexander stars guard the pillion one the sub dom film with all the leather bikers i was expecting like that and then it just turned into this highly highly toxic love story it was so toxic yeah so i did find it hard to like buy into the love story because i was like there is so many red flags here also were you guys raised as brother and sister i'm a bit confused but no i did really enjoy it though i thought it was great i'd recommend to see in the cinema don't
Speaker #1
watch it on tv yeah but that's my door i left it feeling very My short thumb Gozer What's yours, Eudora?
Speaker #0
Mine is also of the viewing nature, my Eudora. Or I'm watching These Sacred Vows on RTE. Roger. It's with Nidge from Love Hate.
Speaker #1
Oh, sorry. I've seen the trailer. Is it good?
Speaker #0
It is brill. Just finished episode three. We were honestly debating last night that it's better than season three of White Lotus.
Speaker #1
Sorry, so I've heard it's the Irish White Lotus.
Speaker #0
Yes, and I totally agree. So it's basically a wedding in Tenerife. like these horrible Irish people on holiday. Like, you know, oh, we're down the golf club here and he's not putting well over there, y'all, y'all, y'all. Like, it's awful.
Speaker #1
Oh, is it bad?
Speaker #0
It's like the people in it, nobody is likable, basically. And Nige gets brought over, Father Vincent O'Keefe gets brought over to do the wedding of these people who he knows and he doesn't really know why. And it's basically every episode, I think there's five or six episodes, but it's taken from a different person's perspective. which is amazing so then the stories kind of overlap and you like go deep on some light on the others everything is in this like crazy blue filter my favourite episode has been the Cormac episode episode number two you know the way we're like bad sisters it's like oh aren't we a bit gassed trying to kill our brother-in-law isn't it a bit funny oh what do you like you stupid eejit and like it's really charming This portrays Irish people in not a nice way. Like it's the way it's kind of shot. It's a little bit like a play sometimes.
Speaker #1
Oh, I want to watch.
Speaker #0
The characters in it are just kind of ugly people. It's just really an interesting take on like quite a simple thing. Like everyone's been to a wedding abroad. There's all the week of like formalities and, oh, we should probably get a priest because we should. And we want to do it in the nice church. I'm really, really, really enjoying it.
Speaker #1
I'm dying to see it. I saw the trailer and I thought it looked brilliant.
Speaker #0
And a slight PS, I also saw the Kate Hudson, Hugh Jackman film, Song Sung Blue, the Neil Diamond biopic. If you need a Friday night drama with some fabulous music, go and watch that. It's a little bit like, I was saying to you, A Star Is Born, but from Milwaukee. And Kate Hudson's accent is so cute in it. She's not going to win Best Actress because of Jessie Buckley at the Oscars, but it is... It's crazy, crazy true story. Everything in what happens in the film is true. And he has so many good songs. So it's all like sweet garyland. It's based off a documentary about this couple. Everything in it is true. Couldn't recommend it anymore. So I've been loving sitting on my couch and watching telly.
Speaker #1
Great records. Right.
Speaker #0
I think we need to talk about the woman of the moment. The woman of the hour.
Speaker #1
Woman of the moment besides you or me. Hilary Duff. I love Hilary Duff. I think I spoke about her recently, just saying she's having a renaissance and I'm so here for it.
Speaker #0
But it's crescendoing now.
Speaker #1
Whoever did the...
Speaker #0
Roll out?
Speaker #1
Yes, but whoever did the aesthetics for it, the wardrobe, the hair and her visuals. Whoa. She has brought her pop star persona from... what 10 15 years ago into modern day she looks so cool she's wearing like aqua sequins like a bodice with like these like cool like denim cargo pants her hair is amazing she looks so she had she her face child's face how's an age today i know whoever does her face whoa i'm loving what she's doing and she's an answer world tour But she went on Call Her Daddy, which I think is always a good read of like, even though I find your one a bit annoying, it's always a good time because they do like an hour and a half, basically. So they can kind of talk about stuff that's not necessarily press points and get in it, getting a bit under the hood. And she speaks about loads of stuff. She talks about like going to the Freaky Friday premiere when Lindsay Lohan was her arch nemesis.
Speaker #0
Iconic.
Speaker #1
Alex is like, oh, like, did you know you were crashing that? And she was like, yeah. she was like chad michael murray asked me i couldn't say no like you should come and i couldn't say no and then he was like he knew she was my arch nemesis i love chad she's like yeah i knew that and then she's like lindsey and i are like grand she's like i ran into her at like a club years later and lindsey turned around goes are we good she's like yeah we're good and then she's like great let's take a shot go on come on all these feuds oh my god i love it she speaks about like Aaron Kars or when he was on her show and like at what point did he start dating her and then she's like you know who's probably dating me and like alluding to the fact he was dating Lindsay Lohan at the same time but he was like there was no social media or anything like that then so like you know anything could be going on you just wouldn't know which I loved and she spoke about her
Speaker #0
and her sister like don't talk so that kind of gets brought up it's really sad there's a song about her on the album like we don't talk
Speaker #1
dying to know what happened.
Speaker #0
But in the lyrics, she says she doesn't know. She's like, I don't know what happened.
Speaker #1
In this thing, she's just like, I don't know at what point it turned into this. She basically says like, she's the person that will reach out.
Speaker #0
I saw one theory. This might be Tim Fulton. I don't know. But they haven't been photographed. Hilary and Hayley have not been photographed together since 2017. When did Hilary get with her now husband, Matthew Coma? 2017.
Speaker #1
So they think it's basically that Hayley, the sister, has a relationship with the ex-husband.
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
And they didn't like this new guy coming in. Also, there's like a political thing. Hillary's Democrat. Hayley's a Republican, moved to Texas. It's really sad. But what's interesting, though, is that Ashley Tisdale's friends with Hayley. And so when Ashley Tisdale did her toxic mom groups thing, Hayley liked it, which was about Hillary. And Hillary confirms that Ashley was talking about her in this.
Speaker #0
Yeah. What was the quote? It was like, I don't think people need to connect many dots.
Speaker #1
No. And she was like, it wouldn't have taken people much time to figure out who she's alluding to. And then your one is like, oh, like, how did it make you feel? She was like, it made me feel really sad. And she said she felt kind of used. And then she basically says she thinks the timing was very...
Speaker #0
It's the spish.
Speaker #1
Interesting.
Speaker #0
Because, like, she knows you're going on a world tour.
Speaker #1
She's like, it felt like pretty awful timing.
Speaker #0
She's like, you're going to ruin her press tour because every single publication is going to go, Toxic Mom Group, Toxic Mom Group, what's the story?
Speaker #1
But the way she spoke about it was really like, yeah, she is talking about us. And, like, it made me feel sad. Which I thought was excellent because it made the whole thing just seem so stupid. She just comes across so nicely.
Speaker #0
She does. But in that one where she was, say when she was talking about her sister, or like her and her dad don't really speak and stuff, she spoke very lovingly about people or like even her ex-husband. Yeah, there's no malice. Yeah, and it was very much like, oh, I have a role to play in it too, blah, But then when it got to the Ashley Tisdale, it was like short answers, awkward. It wasn't like... You could tell that she wanted to say more, but she was just kind of holding back. And like you could tell how she really felt about it by what she didn't say.
Speaker #1
Her tone, totally. And then your one is like, what was your reaction when you saw that your husband got involved?
Speaker #0
Oh, yeah.
Speaker #1
She was like, he's always like there to fight my corner. Very sweet, though. She goes into like the history of her and the new husband.
Speaker #0
Very detailed, yes.
Speaker #1
Back and forth, like being really honest about it. Yeah. Which I really liked.
Speaker #0
They broke up loads. back and forth all the time i couldn't quite understand why they broke up loads no and then like did he throw a bag at her or something and then she got really drunk at an event oh he he like brushed her her with his bag and then and then he contacted her with words with friends it was like
Speaker #1
i don't think the bubbling need to know that part also it just goes to show like sometimes you just held out yeah you know that you just reconnect at the right time But her attitude was so lovely. I love her so much.
Speaker #0
Great. Apparently the tickets were harder to get, like just as hard to get as the Taylor Swift ones, people were saying.
Speaker #1
I haven't tried to get them here. I think they're gone. No, no. Clara I'm sorry. I hate this rat race to get tickets. I'll get them on research.
Speaker #0
Yeah, she might do extra dates or something.
Speaker #1
Thank you. Thank you. I would listen to it. It's a great episode if you like Hilary Duff.
Speaker #0
Yes, she's great. She's given so many revealing interviews. And I love how she's like really writing all her own music. And, you know, we haven't seen her in 20 years and putting all that into music and then being so honest about it. And like, I think she's one of the few child stars that have actually survived and seems like marginally OK.
Speaker #1
Totally. And she's like, you know, it's really hard to sympathize with people in my position because it's like you have money and you have fame or whatever. But she's like she speaks so lovingly about her kids. and her husband she's like I just have such a lovely home life and stuff like it's really nice sentiment she feels very grounded yeah love you Hills love her gather
Speaker #0
you've something about husbands hating wives so there was a bit of commentary last week about this article in the cut the cut are the same people who did the toxic mom group actually
Speaker #1
I love the cut. They're so shady.
Speaker #0
And they did an article that was titled, I love my husband, in brackets, who hates me.
Speaker #1
Been there, queen.
Speaker #0
Yeah. Nothing inspires rage like a woman who defends her partner's bad behaviour, is the title of the article. And what couple do they use as the example to prove the theory? It is Kristen Bell and Dax Shepard. They are the catalyst for this story.
Speaker #1
These are always cropping up, aren't they?
Speaker #0
I know. I think they're like... a little bit too honest about their relationship and then get really annoyed when people comment on it.
Speaker #1
They're almost too therapised.
Speaker #0
Yeah, sure. His fucking podcast is called Armchair Expert.
Speaker #1
And it's a lot like what he talks about there. It's just like a lot of self analysis.
Speaker #0
Navel gazing.
Speaker #1
Almost too like real.
Speaker #0
I think their humour is like degrading.
Speaker #1
Towards each other.
Speaker #0
But it's like, oh no, this is a joke. This is a joke. So remember, we didn't talk about it because I think we're on our you holidays but uh for their anniversary post he like had a picture of dax hugging their daughter and in the comment was like you said one said to me i'd never kill you even though i'm heavily incentivized to kill you and it was during like domestic violence awareness week or something oh dax dax so in the article they talk about the catalyst moment was when share was on their podcast of armchair experts and So Cher was kind of like, oh, she's your better half. So it seems like Cher and Kristen Bell might have like a friendship, which I'd be highly jealous of.
Speaker #1
I feel like Kristen Bell is friends with everyone.
Speaker #0
Yeah, she really is. Dax was like, oh, who would be your dream partner for her? I keep saying for her. And I also was like, call her by her fucking name. I just hate when people say her, her, him, him, he's, he's, she's, she's. I'm like, they have names. Just say their name. Such a pet peeve.
Speaker #1
Yeah.
Speaker #0
Dax was like, oh, who's your dream partner for? her. Cher basically says like, I think she could do better. And then Kristen's like, no, he's too good for me. But it was just this kind of a weird like, what does Cher know that we all don't? And like Cher is like, doesn't hold back, doesn't pull her punches. This article then goes into like how Kristen and Dax had a big fight, a three day silent fight over laundry. There was some argument over a dog. But the article isn't all about that. It was also about like this. TikTok pattern where it's like this trending thing of like, my husband hates me. So a woman will post a story about her husband or partner behaving badly. The audience go, that's degrading, that's abusive. And then she's like, oh, it was just a joke. And then they get into this like weird, like then defending it.
Speaker #1
Did someone say to you about something I said? Like, oh, my boyfriend low-key hates me.
Speaker #0
This is basically the same thing. Yeah.
Speaker #1
Yeah. I had two high-key hated me. High, high-key. Like very high. Like it was very blatant. They hated me. Like the stuff I would do, particularly one, the stuff I would do, he would be like, why are you doing that? Why would you say that? All the time. Oh,
Speaker #0
you need a team player? Yeah,
Speaker #1
no, I did not have that specifically in the second one. He high-key hated me.
Speaker #0
There's a thing in there that like women kind of normalise some of the bad behaviour when they're settling, say, for bad relationships and then they get defensive over it. But also don't publicise your relationship and then when you get critiqued about it, get upset. Because like say Dax Shepard and... Kristen, all their friends have been like rallying around, commenting on it. Like Dax co-host was like, she's the most feminine woman in the world. Their relationship is amazing. This is ridiculous. Take the story down. Her co-host in Nobody Wants This also came out to defend them. So it is a bit of an attack on Kristen. They're using them to sell the story. And the story is about like a wider thing. It's not just about Kristen and Dax.
Speaker #1
They're just using them as the example.
Speaker #0
Yeah. But I just think it's also like they're showing their relationship warts and all. When nobody really does that. So then I think we get a bit prickly because we're just like, no.
Speaker #1
But you don't air your dirty laundry. And if you do, you're opening it up. If you're in the public space, you're opening it up for people to comment on.
Speaker #0
Yeah. And then you, I just, I get annoyed when people get annoyed then that people are making a comment. It's like.
Speaker #1
You're putting it out.
Speaker #0
You can't really get too annoyed about it. But yeah.
Speaker #1
They, their relationship seems like their brand, like part of their brand.
Speaker #0
A hundred percent. I think the first episode of that podcast is them just coming on and like talking about a fight and stuff.
Speaker #1
I can't decide whether I like him or not.
Speaker #0
Yeah, I don't know. There's something about him I just really...
Speaker #1
You know what I find repulsive? The way he calls her Belle. You know in Sentimental in the City and they're like, I have something to say. If a relationship starts off with you calling the other person by their second name...
Speaker #0
it's a dude that is so true never a true if someone was like to me oh you know lions was saying i would like i'm not your fucking teammate pal no and like just say my normal yeah and then another sorry and off the back of that they're like and then any man who like kicks in an object or punches a wall loses
Speaker #1
like 10 percent of their hot 10 percent respect like you'll never get that back no like through throws a handbag isn't it yeah Yeah.
Speaker #0
yeah yeah yeah it's my burger when he kicks that wall oh god gross just going back to it it's like if you're in a relationship and you don't feel like respected by your partner or like sometimes these type of relationships suit people but if you think your partner like low-key high-key hates you then you try to like add humor to it from these women's point of view like is it how they're trying to square the circle of like oh my god I actually don't think my partner respects me So I'm going to kind of make a joke out of it. Then they get defensive when people, they put it on social media or whatever, or tell their friends. Like, I remember when I was in a toxic relationship, I wouldn't say it to anyone.
Speaker #1
No, I was thinking the exact same thing.
Speaker #0
Because I knew the moment it left my lips, everyone I know would be like, that's not okay.
Speaker #1
But also it's you vocalizing something that you don't really want to admit anyway to yourself. So when you say it out loud, it makes it real.
Speaker #0
Yes. Maybe these stories are just a bit more like low key, like, oh, he doesn't do the laundry and we have an argument about it. Or like there's some weird argument over dogs that got a bit boring. But maybe it doesn't have to be like a real toxic behavior relationship. This seems a bit more like low key. I think he kind of hates me. So you're trying to defend somebody? Yeah,
Speaker #1
I think the one I'm talking about, I kind of only realized it like at the end after that he hated me.
Speaker #0
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker #1
Because I wasn't really listening to my own feelings. Yeah, but like he proper hated me.
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
Like he would be like, why did you do that?
Speaker #0
So undermining.
Speaker #1
Why would you say that? Like, that's not someone who gets me. No. But I would, and also I didn't say it to anyone.
Speaker #0
No, that's the thing.
Speaker #1
Because it would be me admitting it and me being like, oh yeah, wait, that's awful. Slash, I would think it's embarrassing. Which it's not.
Speaker #0
So this same scenario, what these ladies are doing by putting it online or putting it for the public consumption, be it on a podcast or on TikTok or whatever, they're just having a different reaction to the same thing. Totally. Say for the two of us, my toxic thing was he was trying to isolate me and like cut me off from other people. You know, you just feel a bit like us against the world, kind of that old trope. So we're just having different reactions to kind of the same toxic behavior. But you just wonder like... are you happy are you coping are you minimizing bad behavior just because you'd rather not be single also like happy is the spectrum isn't it yeah you know when you're looking at these couples and you're like i think if you have to ask yourself am i happy happy I think you just know.
Speaker #1
No, but I think if you're asking, it's the answer,
Speaker #0
isn't it?
Speaker #1
Like, you kind of know the answer if you're asking it. Yeah,
Speaker #0
like, I'm not happy.
Speaker #1
But then I also think people love kind of looking at other couples if they're single or in another relationship and go like, oh, I wouldn't want to be with him. Yeah. Or like, oh, no, no, I don't get that. Yeah. So I think there's a bit of that as well, which is like, I suppose, pretty natural human behaviour. And maybe if you're single. You do that to kind of make yourself feel better. They're like, oh, but I don't want someone like that anyway.
Speaker #0
And as Steve said to Miranda after they broke up, it was like, nobody really knows what happened between me and you except me and you. Like when they broke up. It's easy to have your popcorn on the sidelines and critique all we want, but you kind of don't really know what's going on in the relationship. It's just an unusual way to talk about your partner's bad behavior.
Speaker #1
Also, I'm like, you've kids. They're going to see this when they have... stuff yeah like to be fair we don't know anything about the backhams like we don't know that they have fights over do you know what i mean because they just present this like glossy front but i just think it'd be an awful feeling to like rest your head on a pillow beside someone and you're like does he hate me yeah letting the team down being like oh she's such and such you know those couples who like talk badly about each other in front of one another and they're like oh you wouldn't want to depend on him for that oh my god oh my god don't belittle no no little you're
Speaker #0
partner like that and you're just like oh my god oh my god oh my god and I think that's taught at home it's yeah it's so bad and then you're just like what are you saying to each other like why are you together you don't seem happy yeah I think happiness is like you see happiness you don't say it you can tell when someone's in love you can tell when someone's happy it's very primitive It's not somebody going around going, I'm so happy. I'm so happy. My husband, Loki, hates me. Totally. It's the luck of love. That's how I tell if relationships are real or not. When you see a new relationship, I learned it from a TV show, but who cares? It's the luck of love. You see, you look at how those people look at each other. And sometimes one person is like doughy eyed and the other person's like rolling their eyes. Then you know it's not real and everyone can feel it. You know when someone's talking to like your partner and they're going like, oh, okay. Yeah, and then what happened? Or they're looking at your partner going, oh my God, and then what happened? Like even from a, like it doesn't need to be a romantic thing. You see love, you see happiness.
Speaker #1
That's so true.
Speaker #0
And I just think if you're going online and saying... One of the stories was he... I bought him like an XYZ for Christmas and he bought me a butter dish. It's like, oh, for fuck's sake, he hates you.
Speaker #1
A butter dish.
Speaker #0
A butter dish.
Speaker #1
Okay. Wow. Yeah, the one I'm talking about definitely didn't look at me with loving eyes.
Speaker #0
The look of love. That's it. It's an energy. It's the vibe.
Speaker #1
He would always be like this.
Speaker #0
I kind of... No, you need someone who looks at you.
Speaker #1
Same when he'd be talking to my friends.
Speaker #0
No. Couldn't it? You can just tell.
Speaker #1
Well, I couldn't at the time, sadly.
Speaker #0
It's so primitive. Yeah.
Speaker #1
What TV show did you learn that from?
Speaker #0
Oh, it's amazing. It was a show called Modern Love. It's on Amazon Prime. It's based off articles that were in like New York Times Magazine.
Speaker #1
Oh, I think I've watched that.
Speaker #0
It's in season one. There's an episode where this girl who lives in New York, she has one night stand, ends up having a baby and her Polish doorman ends up kind of half raising the kid and she always brings men back. but the men never meet the approval of the Polish guy and he's just like Eastern European. No, no, no. And then she moves away to L.A. She comes back with the kid. And then he's like really nice to the new partner. And she's like gets him on her own because he's like a fatherly figure. And then she's like, what the hell? Like, why do you like him? And he was like, I was never looking at the men. I was always looking at you and how you look at him. Oh, I make myself cry telling the story all the time.
Speaker #1
Yeah.
Speaker #0
But it is. You're looking at that person and like seeing how happy they are. It's lovely. So yeah, Modern Love, season one. Look for a doorman episode.
Speaker #1
Oh, that's lovely.
Speaker #0
So yeah, okay. There's a little lovey-dovey end. And so, so believe you've a record for us?
Speaker #1
I do. We spoke about it a few weeks ago, but it's released now. So I can tell you that it's fabulous. Love Story. It's on Disney Plus and it's about JFK Jr. and Carolyn Bassett Kennedy.
Speaker #0
Yes. I've been seeing loads about this. Yeah.
Speaker #1
Four episodes are up. It's really good.
Speaker #0
I need to watch it, actually.
Speaker #1
It, like, brings you into, like, you see a bit of, like, Jackie Onassis, who Naomi Watts is playing.
Speaker #0
Shut up.
Speaker #1
In the latter half of her life. And then JFK Jr., who's so dishy and was dishy. I don't know if it's Caroline or Caroline. I think it's Caroline. But she's, like, working in Calvin Klein. She, like, doesn't really care. She's smoking. She, you know, gets up late and just throws on this. this outfit and goes into Calvin Klein and Calvin Klein loves her and all this kind of stuff and then she meets him she meets JFK and she like totally like plays him at his own game she's like no he's like in his head he's like women normally throw themselves at me and she's just like no and there's this back and forth so there's four episodes up I think a fifth one might be out today It's really good because it's kind of like 90s, so like even all the clothes and stuff. It's a really cool time in New York. It's brilliant and I have a fascination with the Kennedys.
Speaker #0
The story, I don't know how, but I know the story ends very tragically.
Speaker #1
Oh, do you not know how it ends?
Speaker #0
Is there someone who's due the plane crash?
Speaker #1
Yeah, I doubt they'll show, they'll just allude to it because it's like really harrowing.
Speaker #0
It's sad, it's mad, that family, there's so much tragedy in it.
Speaker #1
I've been to so many Kennedy museums as a child. I've been to the place in Texas where he was assassinated.
Speaker #0
Oh my gosh.
Speaker #1
I've been to the Kennedy Museum. I've been to the Kennedy Library. I've met a few Kennedys.
Speaker #0
Sophie Kennedy. You've met a few?
Speaker #1
Wait.
Speaker #0
No. Yeah. What?
Speaker #1
Bobby Kennedy Jr.
Speaker #0
Oh my God. In,
Speaker #1
I think it was Hyannis Port. And I think we were trespassing on a private beach.
Speaker #0
But I met a Kennedy.
Speaker #1
On like a family holiday, like with my cousins and stuff. there's a real like Kennedy thing. Yeah. They are fascinating. I know more than the average individual though.
Speaker #0
So deep dive. Sophie O reporting live.
Speaker #1
Oh my God. Sophie O'Nassa slay. Thank you guys so much for joining us for our very early breakfast briefing. I have to go off to work now. Let us know if you want us to talk about anything on our house of gossip. Pod, Instagram or Classic Havana or Soph underscore Lions. Delighted you liked the America's Next Top Model episode. And we have that amazing series that's coming up on E in March, which we have to talk about, which is all the people that you didn't see in this one. So we look forward to that.
Speaker #0
Part two coming soon.
Speaker #1
Yeah. Have a lovely day and cheerio.
Speaker #0
Cheerio

Description

The look of love

Recco of the week: Love Story

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Transcription

Speaker #0
Are you ready? We ride it's on We ride it's on This is House of Gossip's earliest recording ever, I won't tell you what time it is. But welcome along to House of Gossip, your weekly dose of book culture nourishment with myself, Clara Kavanagh, and you, Sophie Lyons. How are you getting on, girly?
Speaker #1
Me Me too I've got you, Lyons. Breakfast briefing for the girls.
Speaker #0
Woo woo I feel energised. I feel ready for the week. Ready for the weekend. Thank you so much for all your comments and DMs about our ANTM episode. We really enjoyed getting under the hood of it and talking about the toxic relationship that existed between ourselves as viewers and Tyrone Banks, the executive producer who said she had no production. controlled but also said she was the master editor it's not really my area executive producer across the screen i'm gonna start saying that in work when i do something wrong yeah it's not really my area it's hard for me to talk about it because it's not really my area but everyone's favorite pure guru kelly katrone from the hills and the city fame has chimed in in the meantime and i just wanted to make a quick little reference to it so she overlapped with jay manuel the jays and Nigel. for one season, 18 seasons. So like their last one after, and then they got fired. And then she went on to do from 18, seasons 18 to 22, or cycles 18 to 22. But she goes on Instagram this week. Side note, Jay never worked in the fashion industry. He worked at MAC Makeup Counter in Toronto.
Speaker #1
Sorry, I did read this.
Speaker #0
Yeah, Tyra boosted him. And how did he repay her? By writing a novel about her and the show, which nobody bought. And now he's trying to become relevant by being out there trashing her again. Maybe he will get a deal as a spokesperson for a spray tanning or filler. He was so incredibly rude to me on my first day on the show. He came up to me and said, welcome to the show. You are in the ejector seat, meaning anyone who sat in that seat, Andre, etc., was fired. Oddly enough, what happened to him at the end of that season? So I do love her honesty.
Speaker #1
I do too. I always liked it.
Speaker #0
Yeah, I don't know why she signed with Tyra though, but...
Speaker #1
I can analyze this.
Speaker #0
Okay.
Speaker #1
He obviously was scorned since cycle eight because he was like, I want to leave. And then he basically was imprisoned.
Speaker #0
Yes.
Speaker #1
And so he had to continue on. And you see these people come and go and he wanted to go, but they were like, you'll be blacklisted.
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
So he was basically stuck there.
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
And I think naturally as a human being, if someone new came in, who Callie Catrone is quite spicy. I'd say he was really like, oh, you don't know what you're in for.
Speaker #0
Yeah. And he's also had 18 cycles of trauma.
Speaker #1
Like a lot. Yeah. But I do like Kelly Catrone.
Speaker #0
I do. It's interesting.
Speaker #1
So it's sad they're not friends. They could have been a good calling him a makeup artist from Mac. That is a dig.
Speaker #0
Dig. So, yeah, enjoyed that during the week. OK, now, so what are you, is J'Adore you're testing from your week?
Speaker #1
I'm J'Adore a trip to the cinema that me and my good friend Clara made this weekend.
Speaker #0
Oh, a little excursion.
Speaker #1
Sorry, we're also wearing the same top half with our Sophie and Clara necklaces and a black long sleeve and hoops. We're such good friends. Clara and I went to see Wuthering Heights, which I thought it was amazing. I don't know too much about the literature behind it. I didn't know what I was going into. I don't read reviews beforehand. If you listen, you'll know I do not read reviews beforehand I want to have my own thought on it I thought it was brilliant. Spoiler alert at the end of this because I'll say something about one bit I thought was amazing. The set.
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
Wow.
Speaker #0
Oh my god.
Speaker #1
The set and the costumes were unbelievable.
Speaker #0
They told the story. They were like a character. Yeah.
Speaker #1
Oh my god and the detail. You kind of felt like you were in them when you were watching it. Yeah. Like when you were in the dirty house you were a bit like oh yeah And then in the other big house, which was stunning, but the environment not so much. I actually just listened to something and they called it sterile, which I thought was such a good word to describe it. Because it was stunning for your eyes, aesthetically. But the love wasn't the same there between Catherine and, what is he, a lord or whatever?
Speaker #0
Edgar.
Speaker #1
Wait, no, is that not Jacob Elordi's character?
Speaker #0
No, Edgar was... No, that's Heath Clegg.
Speaker #1
sorry about that Jacob Elordi as Edgar he's Heathcliff forgive me the sexual escapades when they get into the mid bit of the movie where they're just like having sex all the time in secret Whoa.
Speaker #0
Can I sound like a bit of a creep though?
Speaker #1
Go on.
Speaker #0
Just because Saltburn was so kind of out there with its sexual stuff, I definitely thought we'd see like a boob or something.
Speaker #1
No, I knew because it was two big stars, we wouldn't see it.
Speaker #0
Yeah, I felt like there was a little bit of a veil over it. I thought they might, just with all the press and everything, I thought it was going to be a bit more on the sexual side.
Speaker #1
I think it was without being graphic.
Speaker #0
Yeah, it was. It was in a different way.
Speaker #1
Like, you know the bit where she's masturbating?
Speaker #0
Yes, behind the rock.
Speaker #1
Plush my pearls. Yeah. And like at the start of the movie, you know, the noise that you think is, sounds like people having sex. That bit. You know the bit where they're in the barn thing?
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
And the two housekeepers come over and they use like horse equipment.
Speaker #0
Yeah, a bridle.
Speaker #1
A bridle. Yeah. Oh my God, that was hot. Sorry, it was just very sexual. I don't know if it was hot.
Speaker #0
And then it kind of got into all the kinky stuff with that Irish actress, Alison Oliver, as Isabella. She was great, I thought.
Speaker #1
Is Nellie the dog?
Speaker #0
No, Nellie was the housemate who interfered too much.
Speaker #1
Oh.
Speaker #0
You don't know anyone's names.
Speaker #1
The Isabella thing with the dog was like bonkers because it went so, like it started off as really like... you know, she's getting married to this lord and like there's loads of fog. Yeah, yeah. And then there's this girl in like this tea party dress pretending she's a dog.
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
With Heathcliff. So it kind of flip-flops from one side to the other, which is quite nice as a viewer. His Yorkshire accent.
Speaker #0
Mmm.
Speaker #1
Excellent. Yes,
Speaker #0
very good.
Speaker #1
He was really good with the accent. And this is the spoiler, the bit at the end.
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
Oh, I... burst out crying when he's like she's dead isn't she she's dead at that point and he's like next to her he's left and he's like be with me always take any form oh my god that was hard wasn't it and then i look over assuming clara's blubbering too and
Speaker #0
her face is dry and i was fully weeping and usually it's the other way around you'd say like a half a sentence to me and i'd start crying yeah and you were like oh god and then i and you were just like oh yeah bone dry i don't know what happened to me no it's not a problem it's fine the movie was very different to what i thought it was going to be and i just thought it was going to be a big like kink fest or something i was going in expecting you know that like new film with alexander stars guard the pillion one the sub dom film with all the leather bikers i was expecting like that and then it just turned into this highly highly toxic love story it was so toxic yeah so i did find it hard to like buy into the love story because i was like there is so many red flags here also were you guys raised as brother and sister i'm a bit confused but no i did really enjoy it though i thought it was great i'd recommend to see in the cinema don't
Speaker #1
watch it on tv yeah but that's my door i left it feeling very My short thumb Gozer What's yours, Eudora?
Speaker #0
Mine is also of the viewing nature, my Eudora. Or I'm watching These Sacred Vows on RTE. Roger. It's with Nidge from Love Hate.
Speaker #1
Oh, sorry. I've seen the trailer. Is it good?
Speaker #0
It is brill. Just finished episode three. We were honestly debating last night that it's better than season three of White Lotus.
Speaker #1
Sorry, so I've heard it's the Irish White Lotus.
Speaker #0
Yes, and I totally agree. So it's basically a wedding in Tenerife. like these horrible Irish people on holiday. Like, you know, oh, we're down the golf club here and he's not putting well over there, y'all, y'all, y'all. Like, it's awful.
Speaker #1
Oh, is it bad?
Speaker #0
It's like the people in it, nobody is likable, basically. And Nige gets brought over, Father Vincent O'Keefe gets brought over to do the wedding of these people who he knows and he doesn't really know why. And it's basically every episode, I think there's five or six episodes, but it's taken from a different person's perspective. which is amazing so then the stories kind of overlap and you like go deep on some light on the others everything is in this like crazy blue filter my favourite episode has been the Cormac episode episode number two you know the way we're like bad sisters it's like oh aren't we a bit gassed trying to kill our brother-in-law isn't it a bit funny oh what do you like you stupid eejit and like it's really charming This portrays Irish people in not a nice way. Like it's the way it's kind of shot. It's a little bit like a play sometimes.
Speaker #1
Oh, I want to watch.
Speaker #0
The characters in it are just kind of ugly people. It's just really an interesting take on like quite a simple thing. Like everyone's been to a wedding abroad. There's all the week of like formalities and, oh, we should probably get a priest because we should. And we want to do it in the nice church. I'm really, really, really enjoying it.
Speaker #1
I'm dying to see it. I saw the trailer and I thought it looked brilliant.
Speaker #0
And a slight PS, I also saw the Kate Hudson, Hugh Jackman film, Song Sung Blue, the Neil Diamond biopic. If you need a Friday night drama with some fabulous music, go and watch that. It's a little bit like, I was saying to you, A Star Is Born, but from Milwaukee. And Kate Hudson's accent is so cute in it. She's not going to win Best Actress because of Jessie Buckley at the Oscars, but it is... It's crazy, crazy true story. Everything in what happens in the film is true. And he has so many good songs. So it's all like sweet garyland. It's based off a documentary about this couple. Everything in it is true. Couldn't recommend it anymore. So I've been loving sitting on my couch and watching telly.
Speaker #1
Great records. Right.
Speaker #0
I think we need to talk about the woman of the moment. The woman of the hour.
Speaker #1
Woman of the moment besides you or me. Hilary Duff. I love Hilary Duff. I think I spoke about her recently, just saying she's having a renaissance and I'm so here for it.
Speaker #0
But it's crescendoing now.
Speaker #1
Whoever did the...
Speaker #0
Roll out?
Speaker #1
Yes, but whoever did the aesthetics for it, the wardrobe, the hair and her visuals. Whoa. She has brought her pop star persona from... what 10 15 years ago into modern day she looks so cool she's wearing like aqua sequins like a bodice with like these like cool like denim cargo pants her hair is amazing she looks so she had she her face child's face how's an age today i know whoever does her face whoa i'm loving what she's doing and she's an answer world tour But she went on Call Her Daddy, which I think is always a good read of like, even though I find your one a bit annoying, it's always a good time because they do like an hour and a half, basically. So they can kind of talk about stuff that's not necessarily press points and get in it, getting a bit under the hood. And she speaks about loads of stuff. She talks about like going to the Freaky Friday premiere when Lindsay Lohan was her arch nemesis.
Speaker #0
Iconic.
Speaker #1
Alex is like, oh, like, did you know you were crashing that? And she was like, yeah. she was like chad michael murray asked me i couldn't say no like you should come and i couldn't say no and then he was like he knew she was my arch nemesis i love chad she's like yeah i knew that and then she's like lindsey and i are like grand she's like i ran into her at like a club years later and lindsey turned around goes are we good she's like yeah we're good and then she's like great let's take a shot go on come on all these feuds oh my god i love it she speaks about like Aaron Kars or when he was on her show and like at what point did he start dating her and then she's like you know who's probably dating me and like alluding to the fact he was dating Lindsay Lohan at the same time but he was like there was no social media or anything like that then so like you know anything could be going on you just wouldn't know which I loved and she spoke about her
Speaker #0
and her sister like don't talk so that kind of gets brought up it's really sad there's a song about her on the album like we don't talk
Speaker #1
dying to know what happened.
Speaker #0
But in the lyrics, she says she doesn't know. She's like, I don't know what happened.
Speaker #1
In this thing, she's just like, I don't know at what point it turned into this. She basically says like, she's the person that will reach out.
Speaker #0
I saw one theory. This might be Tim Fulton. I don't know. But they haven't been photographed. Hilary and Hayley have not been photographed together since 2017. When did Hilary get with her now husband, Matthew Coma? 2017.
Speaker #1
So they think it's basically that Hayley, the sister, has a relationship with the ex-husband.
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
And they didn't like this new guy coming in. Also, there's like a political thing. Hillary's Democrat. Hayley's a Republican, moved to Texas. It's really sad. But what's interesting, though, is that Ashley Tisdale's friends with Hayley. And so when Ashley Tisdale did her toxic mom groups thing, Hayley liked it, which was about Hillary. And Hillary confirms that Ashley was talking about her in this.
Speaker #0
Yeah. What was the quote? It was like, I don't think people need to connect many dots.
Speaker #1
No. And she was like, it wouldn't have taken people much time to figure out who she's alluding to. And then your one is like, oh, like, how did it make you feel? She was like, it made me feel really sad. And she said she felt kind of used. And then she basically says she thinks the timing was very...
Speaker #0
It's the spish.
Speaker #1
Interesting.
Speaker #0
Because, like, she knows you're going on a world tour.
Speaker #1
She's like, it felt like pretty awful timing.
Speaker #0
She's like, you're going to ruin her press tour because every single publication is going to go, Toxic Mom Group, Toxic Mom Group, what's the story?
Speaker #1
But the way she spoke about it was really like, yeah, she is talking about us. And, like, it made me feel sad. Which I thought was excellent because it made the whole thing just seem so stupid. She just comes across so nicely.
Speaker #0
She does. But in that one where she was, say when she was talking about her sister, or like her and her dad don't really speak and stuff, she spoke very lovingly about people or like even her ex-husband. Yeah, there's no malice. Yeah, and it was very much like, oh, I have a role to play in it too, blah, But then when it got to the Ashley Tisdale, it was like short answers, awkward. It wasn't like... You could tell that she wanted to say more, but she was just kind of holding back. And like you could tell how she really felt about it by what she didn't say.
Speaker #1
Her tone, totally. And then your one is like, what was your reaction when you saw that your husband got involved?
Speaker #0
Oh, yeah.
Speaker #1
She was like, he's always like there to fight my corner. Very sweet, though. She goes into like the history of her and the new husband.
Speaker #0
Very detailed, yes.
Speaker #1
Back and forth, like being really honest about it. Yeah. Which I really liked.
Speaker #0
They broke up loads. back and forth all the time i couldn't quite understand why they broke up loads no and then like did he throw a bag at her or something and then she got really drunk at an event oh he he like brushed her her with his bag and then and then he contacted her with words with friends it was like
Speaker #1
i don't think the bubbling need to know that part also it just goes to show like sometimes you just held out yeah you know that you just reconnect at the right time But her attitude was so lovely. I love her so much.
Speaker #0
Great. Apparently the tickets were harder to get, like just as hard to get as the Taylor Swift ones, people were saying.
Speaker #1
I haven't tried to get them here. I think they're gone. No, no. Clara I'm sorry. I hate this rat race to get tickets. I'll get them on research.
Speaker #0
Yeah, she might do extra dates or something.
Speaker #1
Thank you. Thank you. I would listen to it. It's a great episode if you like Hilary Duff.
Speaker #0
Yes, she's great. She's given so many revealing interviews. And I love how she's like really writing all her own music. And, you know, we haven't seen her in 20 years and putting all that into music and then being so honest about it. And like, I think she's one of the few child stars that have actually survived and seems like marginally OK.
Speaker #1
Totally. And she's like, you know, it's really hard to sympathize with people in my position because it's like you have money and you have fame or whatever. But she's like she speaks so lovingly about her kids. and her husband she's like I just have such a lovely home life and stuff like it's really nice sentiment she feels very grounded yeah love you Hills love her gather
Speaker #0
you've something about husbands hating wives so there was a bit of commentary last week about this article in the cut the cut are the same people who did the toxic mom group actually
Speaker #1
I love the cut. They're so shady.
Speaker #0
And they did an article that was titled, I love my husband, in brackets, who hates me.
Speaker #1
Been there, queen.
Speaker #0
Yeah. Nothing inspires rage like a woman who defends her partner's bad behaviour, is the title of the article. And what couple do they use as the example to prove the theory? It is Kristen Bell and Dax Shepard. They are the catalyst for this story.
Speaker #1
These are always cropping up, aren't they?
Speaker #0
I know. I think they're like... a little bit too honest about their relationship and then get really annoyed when people comment on it.
Speaker #1
They're almost too therapised.
Speaker #0
Yeah, sure. His fucking podcast is called Armchair Expert.
Speaker #1
And it's a lot like what he talks about there. It's just like a lot of self analysis.
Speaker #0
Navel gazing.
Speaker #1
Almost too like real.
Speaker #0
I think their humour is like degrading.
Speaker #1
Towards each other.
Speaker #0
But it's like, oh no, this is a joke. This is a joke. So remember, we didn't talk about it because I think we're on our you holidays but uh for their anniversary post he like had a picture of dax hugging their daughter and in the comment was like you said one said to me i'd never kill you even though i'm heavily incentivized to kill you and it was during like domestic violence awareness week or something oh dax dax so in the article they talk about the catalyst moment was when share was on their podcast of armchair experts and So Cher was kind of like, oh, she's your better half. So it seems like Cher and Kristen Bell might have like a friendship, which I'd be highly jealous of.
Speaker #1
I feel like Kristen Bell is friends with everyone.
Speaker #0
Yeah, she really is. Dax was like, oh, who would be your dream partner for her? I keep saying for her. And I also was like, call her by her fucking name. I just hate when people say her, her, him, him, he's, he's, she's, she's. I'm like, they have names. Just say their name. Such a pet peeve.
Speaker #1
Yeah.
Speaker #0
Dax was like, oh, who's your dream partner for? her. Cher basically says like, I think she could do better. And then Kristen's like, no, he's too good for me. But it was just this kind of a weird like, what does Cher know that we all don't? And like Cher is like, doesn't hold back, doesn't pull her punches. This article then goes into like how Kristen and Dax had a big fight, a three day silent fight over laundry. There was some argument over a dog. But the article isn't all about that. It was also about like this. TikTok pattern where it's like this trending thing of like, my husband hates me. So a woman will post a story about her husband or partner behaving badly. The audience go, that's degrading, that's abusive. And then she's like, oh, it was just a joke. And then they get into this like weird, like then defending it.
Speaker #1
Did someone say to you about something I said? Like, oh, my boyfriend low-key hates me.
Speaker #0
This is basically the same thing. Yeah.
Speaker #1
Yeah. I had two high-key hated me. High, high-key. Like very high. Like it was very blatant. They hated me. Like the stuff I would do, particularly one, the stuff I would do, he would be like, why are you doing that? Why would you say that? All the time. Oh,
Speaker #0
you need a team player? Yeah,
Speaker #1
no, I did not have that specifically in the second one. He high-key hated me.
Speaker #0
There's a thing in there that like women kind of normalise some of the bad behaviour when they're settling, say, for bad relationships and then they get defensive over it. But also don't publicise your relationship and then when you get critiqued about it, get upset. Because like say Dax Shepard and... Kristen, all their friends have been like rallying around, commenting on it. Like Dax co-host was like, she's the most feminine woman in the world. Their relationship is amazing. This is ridiculous. Take the story down. Her co-host in Nobody Wants This also came out to defend them. So it is a bit of an attack on Kristen. They're using them to sell the story. And the story is about like a wider thing. It's not just about Kristen and Dax.
Speaker #1
They're just using them as the example.
Speaker #0
Yeah. But I just think it's also like they're showing their relationship warts and all. When nobody really does that. So then I think we get a bit prickly because we're just like, no.
Speaker #1
But you don't air your dirty laundry. And if you do, you're opening it up. If you're in the public space, you're opening it up for people to comment on.
Speaker #0
Yeah. And then you, I just, I get annoyed when people get annoyed then that people are making a comment. It's like.
Speaker #1
You're putting it out.
Speaker #0
You can't really get too annoyed about it. But yeah.
Speaker #1
They, their relationship seems like their brand, like part of their brand.
Speaker #0
A hundred percent. I think the first episode of that podcast is them just coming on and like talking about a fight and stuff.
Speaker #1
I can't decide whether I like him or not.
Speaker #0
Yeah, I don't know. There's something about him I just really...
Speaker #1
You know what I find repulsive? The way he calls her Belle. You know in Sentimental in the City and they're like, I have something to say. If a relationship starts off with you calling the other person by their second name...
Speaker #0
it's a dude that is so true never a true if someone was like to me oh you know lions was saying i would like i'm not your fucking teammate pal no and like just say my normal yeah and then another sorry and off the back of that they're like and then any man who like kicks in an object or punches a wall loses
Speaker #1
like 10 percent of their hot 10 percent respect like you'll never get that back no like through throws a handbag isn't it yeah Yeah.
Speaker #0
yeah yeah yeah it's my burger when he kicks that wall oh god gross just going back to it it's like if you're in a relationship and you don't feel like respected by your partner or like sometimes these type of relationships suit people but if you think your partner like low-key high-key hates you then you try to like add humor to it from these women's point of view like is it how they're trying to square the circle of like oh my god I actually don't think my partner respects me So I'm going to kind of make a joke out of it. Then they get defensive when people, they put it on social media or whatever, or tell their friends. Like, I remember when I was in a toxic relationship, I wouldn't say it to anyone.
Speaker #1
No, I was thinking the exact same thing.
Speaker #0
Because I knew the moment it left my lips, everyone I know would be like, that's not okay.
Speaker #1
But also it's you vocalizing something that you don't really want to admit anyway to yourself. So when you say it out loud, it makes it real.
Speaker #0
Yes. Maybe these stories are just a bit more like low key, like, oh, he doesn't do the laundry and we have an argument about it. Or like there's some weird argument over dogs that got a bit boring. But maybe it doesn't have to be like a real toxic behavior relationship. This seems a bit more like low key. I think he kind of hates me. So you're trying to defend somebody? Yeah,
Speaker #1
I think the one I'm talking about, I kind of only realized it like at the end after that he hated me.
Speaker #0
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker #1
Because I wasn't really listening to my own feelings. Yeah, but like he proper hated me.
Speaker #0
Yeah.
Speaker #1
Like he would be like, why did you do that?
Speaker #0
So undermining.
Speaker #1
Why would you say that? Like, that's not someone who gets me. No. But I would, and also I didn't say it to anyone.
Speaker #0
No, that's the thing.
Speaker #1
Because it would be me admitting it and me being like, oh yeah, wait, that's awful. Slash, I would think it's embarrassing. Which it's not.
Speaker #0
So this same scenario, what these ladies are doing by putting it online or putting it for the public consumption, be it on a podcast or on TikTok or whatever, they're just having a different reaction to the same thing. Totally. Say for the two of us, my toxic thing was he was trying to isolate me and like cut me off from other people. You know, you just feel a bit like us against the world, kind of that old trope. So we're just having different reactions to kind of the same toxic behavior. But you just wonder like... are you happy are you coping are you minimizing bad behavior just because you'd rather not be single also like happy is the spectrum isn't it yeah you know when you're looking at these couples and you're like i think if you have to ask yourself am i happy happy I think you just know.
Speaker #1
No, but I think if you're asking, it's the answer,
Speaker #0
isn't it?
Speaker #1
Like, you kind of know the answer if you're asking it. Yeah,
Speaker #0
like, I'm not happy.
Speaker #1
But then I also think people love kind of looking at other couples if they're single or in another relationship and go like, oh, I wouldn't want to be with him. Yeah. Or like, oh, no, no, I don't get that. Yeah. So I think there's a bit of that as well, which is like, I suppose, pretty natural human behaviour. And maybe if you're single. You do that to kind of make yourself feel better. They're like, oh, but I don't want someone like that anyway.
Speaker #0
And as Steve said to Miranda after they broke up, it was like, nobody really knows what happened between me and you except me and you. Like when they broke up. It's easy to have your popcorn on the sidelines and critique all we want, but you kind of don't really know what's going on in the relationship. It's just an unusual way to talk about your partner's bad behavior.
Speaker #1
Also, I'm like, you've kids. They're going to see this when they have... stuff yeah like to be fair we don't know anything about the backhams like we don't know that they have fights over do you know what i mean because they just present this like glossy front but i just think it'd be an awful feeling to like rest your head on a pillow beside someone and you're like does he hate me yeah letting the team down being like oh she's such and such you know those couples who like talk badly about each other in front of one another and they're like oh you wouldn't want to depend on him for that oh my god oh my god don't belittle no no little you're
Speaker #0
partner like that and you're just like oh my god oh my god oh my god and I think that's taught at home it's yeah it's so bad and then you're just like what are you saying to each other like why are you together you don't seem happy yeah I think happiness is like you see happiness you don't say it you can tell when someone's in love you can tell when someone's happy it's very primitive It's not somebody going around going, I'm so happy. I'm so happy. My husband, Loki, hates me. Totally. It's the luck of love. That's how I tell if relationships are real or not. When you see a new relationship, I learned it from a TV show, but who cares? It's the luck of love. You see, you look at how those people look at each other. And sometimes one person is like doughy eyed and the other person's like rolling their eyes. Then you know it's not real and everyone can feel it. You know when someone's talking to like your partner and they're going like, oh, okay. Yeah, and then what happened? Or they're looking at your partner going, oh my God, and then what happened? Like even from a, like it doesn't need to be a romantic thing. You see love, you see happiness.
Speaker #1
That's so true.
Speaker #0
And I just think if you're going online and saying... One of the stories was he... I bought him like an XYZ for Christmas and he bought me a butter dish. It's like, oh, for fuck's sake, he hates you.
Speaker #1
A butter dish.
Speaker #0
A butter dish.
Speaker #1
Okay. Wow. Yeah, the one I'm talking about definitely didn't look at me with loving eyes.
Speaker #0
The look of love. That's it. It's an energy. It's the vibe.
Speaker #1
He would always be like this.
Speaker #0
I kind of... No, you need someone who looks at you.
Speaker #1
Same when he'd be talking to my friends.
Speaker #0
No. Couldn't it? You can just tell.
Speaker #1
Well, I couldn't at the time, sadly.
Speaker #0
It's so primitive. Yeah.
Speaker #1
What TV show did you learn that from?
Speaker #0
Oh, it's amazing. It was a show called Modern Love. It's on Amazon Prime. It's based off articles that were in like New York Times Magazine.
Speaker #1
Oh, I think I've watched that.
Speaker #0
It's in season one. There's an episode where this girl who lives in New York, she has one night stand, ends up having a baby and her Polish doorman ends up kind of half raising the kid and she always brings men back. but the men never meet the approval of the Polish guy and he's just like Eastern European. No, no, no. And then she moves away to L.A. She comes back with the kid. And then he's like really nice to the new partner. And she's like gets him on her own because he's like a fatherly figure. And then she's like, what the hell? Like, why do you like him? And he was like, I was never looking at the men. I was always looking at you and how you look at him. Oh, I make myself cry telling the story all the time.
Speaker #1
Yeah.
Speaker #0
But it is. You're looking at that person and like seeing how happy they are. It's lovely. So yeah, Modern Love, season one. Look for a doorman episode.
Speaker #1
Oh, that's lovely.
Speaker #0
So yeah, okay. There's a little lovey-dovey end. And so, so believe you've a record for us?
Speaker #1
I do. We spoke about it a few weeks ago, but it's released now. So I can tell you that it's fabulous. Love Story. It's on Disney Plus and it's about JFK Jr. and Carolyn Bassett Kennedy.
Speaker #0
Yes. I've been seeing loads about this. Yeah.
Speaker #1
Four episodes are up. It's really good.
Speaker #0
I need to watch it, actually.
Speaker #1
It, like, brings you into, like, you see a bit of, like, Jackie Onassis, who Naomi Watts is playing.
Speaker #0
Shut up.
Speaker #1
In the latter half of her life. And then JFK Jr., who's so dishy and was dishy. I don't know if it's Caroline or Caroline. I think it's Caroline. But she's, like, working in Calvin Klein. She, like, doesn't really care. She's smoking. She, you know, gets up late and just throws on this. this outfit and goes into Calvin Klein and Calvin Klein loves her and all this kind of stuff and then she meets him she meets JFK and she like totally like plays him at his own game she's like no he's like in his head he's like women normally throw themselves at me and she's just like no and there's this back and forth so there's four episodes up I think a fifth one might be out today It's really good because it's kind of like 90s, so like even all the clothes and stuff. It's a really cool time in New York. It's brilliant and I have a fascination with the Kennedys.
Speaker #0
The story, I don't know how, but I know the story ends very tragically.
Speaker #1
Oh, do you not know how it ends?
Speaker #0
Is there someone who's due the plane crash?
Speaker #1
Yeah, I doubt they'll show, they'll just allude to it because it's like really harrowing.
Speaker #0
It's sad, it's mad, that family, there's so much tragedy in it.
Speaker #1
I've been to so many Kennedy museums as a child. I've been to the place in Texas where he was assassinated.
Speaker #0
Oh my gosh.
Speaker #1
I've been to the Kennedy Museum. I've been to the Kennedy Library. I've met a few Kennedys.
Speaker #0
Sophie Kennedy. You've met a few?
Speaker #1
Wait.
Speaker #0
No. Yeah. What?
Speaker #1
Bobby Kennedy Jr.
Speaker #0
Oh my God. In,
Speaker #1
I think it was Hyannis Port. And I think we were trespassing on a private beach.
Speaker #0
But I met a Kennedy.
Speaker #1
On like a family holiday, like with my cousins and stuff. there's a real like Kennedy thing. Yeah. They are fascinating. I know more than the average individual though.
Speaker #0
So deep dive. Sophie O reporting live.
Speaker #1
Oh my God. Sophie O'Nassa slay. Thank you guys so much for joining us for our very early breakfast briefing. I have to go off to work now. Let us know if you want us to talk about anything on our house of gossip. Pod, Instagram or Classic Havana or Soph underscore Lions. Delighted you liked the America's Next Top Model episode. And we have that amazing series that's coming up on E in March, which we have to talk about, which is all the people that you didn't see in this one. So we look forward to that.
Speaker #0
Part two coming soon.
Speaker #1
Yeah. Have a lovely day and cheerio.
Speaker #0
Cheerio

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