Transcription

• Speaker #0

  CIVIS Waves, surfing through the sounds and diving into the voices of our CIVIS University Alliance and beyond. Welcome to Civis Connect, the podcast of the Open Labs of the Civis Alliance, I’m Maud Rebibou from Aix-Marseille University. Together with our colleagues from the CIVIS Alliance, a university network that carries in its heart the citizen engagement. nous poursuivons notre série de podcasts sur la recherche participative et ses enjeux. Dans ce quatrième épisode, nous allons découvrir le projet VOOM, porté par Véronique Masotti et Anne Gannepien. Véronique, Anne, pouvez-vous vous présenter ?

• Speaker #2

  Bonjour à tous, je suis Véronique Masotti, je suis enseignante-chercheure à Aix-Marseille Université. Mon laboratoire de recherche, c'est l'Institut Méditerranéen de Biodiversité et d'Écologie, IMB. and I do plant ecology in this structure.

• Speaker #3

  Hello everyone, my name is Anne Gagnevien, I am a conference teacher at the UFR1G Media, at the University of Toulon, at the IMSIC laboratory, the Mediterranean Institute of Information and Communication Sciences. My research focuses on citizen participation and the communication of the socio-ecological transition for various research projects. And I am also a founding member of the BOOM association. Together with Véronique, we are carrying out a project that we are considering to transform the way we do science and agriculture in the city. And our objective is to create collective orchards where the inhabitants are not just spectators, but co-producers of knowledge.

• Speaker #1

  Very well, you have introduced the VOOM project, towards open, urban and Mediterranean orchards. Can you tell me more about what... What is this project about?

• Speaker #3

  If you will, it's a hybrid project that we can consider as unique and I'm going to take it back in three points. To know that it's a collective orchard that is managed from A to Z by the inhabitants, from the preparation on the ground to the harvest. It's also what we consider as a scientific experimental station that tests models of zero-phytos orchards, without pesticides in the urban environment. And finally, it's a place of mediation where science, nature and social links meet. And concretely, since the beginning of 2024, we have planted about 100 trees, 400 shrubs, and we don't just try to produce fruit, we also produce knowledge about biodiversity and the resilience of urban ecosystems.

• Speaker #1

  Very clear, thank you. And It makes me wonder what led you to start in participatory research, participatory action research.

• Speaker #3

  We first identified two major needs that could not be met by classical research, if you will. There was first a scientific need, because producing fruit without pesticides is a world challenge today. And then the traditional experimental stations are too few. and even too isolated to test models in varied urban contexts. So we had to multiply and create a orchard, then in the future create experimentation sites. And then it's also a societal need. Citizens are in demand for short circuits, in connection with nature and meaning too. And our investigations show that they are ready to put their hand in the earth. And participatory research is a method that can articulate these two needs, transform the orchards into real open laboratories, where the volunteers actively contribute to the production of knowledge.

• Speaker #2

  As far as I'm concerned, action research is a way of proceeding that we have already commonly applied in my laboratory, in my research institute. So I wasn't completely new to this type of operation either. However, what I saw in the Afri Basin and in the PosaFri project, it was really the opportunity to get out of the beaten tracks anyway and to have a larger amount of data. When we do scientific ecology, having repetition is a quality issue. The problem is that I am a researcher and I can't multiply infinitely and we're missing. all, cruelly, of human resources to be able to do the manipulations that are necessary to ensure a quality data. And so, having a use for motivated citizens, it allows us to alleviate this lack of human resources.

• Speaker #1

  You have shown us that VOOM offers a format that is both original and special for research. How does this allow you to exceed the limits of a classic research?

• Speaker #3

  If you want, our approach exceeds the classic research that I will explain to you on three points. The first is the question of scale and diversity. We want to develop a potential network of VRGs. in very varied urban contexts, and it will allow us to collect data on a larger scale, like the Véronique explicit, than our orchard on biodiversity, especially soil biodiversity. And there is also the role of co-conception. In classical research, the researcher observes. Here, citizens co-concept the orchard. The protocols are made by the researchers, of course. but the management rules are made by the inhabitants and volunteers. And in fact, the volunteers are no longer subjects, if you will, but full-time partners of the project. And finally, what we also wanted to enhance, is social robustness. By integrating the social dimension from the conception of this project, we created urban communities, if you will, sustainable urban communities. And the VRG is not just a study object, in fact. It's a good that is managed collectively, and it's precisely because this good is managed collectively that it guarantees its sustainability, well beyond the scope of a research project, in fact.

• Speaker #2

  More concretely, in relation to a classic research, when you have to create knowledge, you mobilize people, people who know. who know what they're talking about, who already have a common knowledge base. The idea in the Verger is that we contribute to the profane of research and we will train them on a set of tasks that will be accessible to them to be able to get the quality data back. So my speech when I'm in front of them, it changes compared to when I'm in a field school where I have all my students in front of me. I don't have the same vocabulary. When I have a class, when I have my students, I know the common knowledge that they have at their disposal, so I adapt my language. There, I really have to individualize my speech, because some already know what plant I'm talking about, others already know when we talk to them about arachnid or acariens, they already see what we're talking about, others not at all. It's stored under the term of beast, you see, so you really have to try to adapt the vocabulary individually. And suddenly, it changes my mindset because I'm not teaching, I'm not in front of a class group, I'm really facing other people and it requires a little mental gymnastics. This being said, in the end, it doesn't matter to me that Dominique or Alain are not the major promoters of the Master in Ecology. The idea is that I will have to build knowledge from their data collection. So I have to appropriate the material in order to be able to transmit to them what they must know.

• Speaker #1

  And you have introduced a little bit how you are going to integrate participants in the context of this project. Can you explain a little bit the role? that you gave them or that you still give them?

• Speaker #3

  At the level of the design, we used participatory workshops so that the inhabitants can imagine the orchard. And this is mainly, of course, we had two colleagues, the GRAB, the Institute of Biological Agriculture, and then also the president of our university, Sylvain Tacker-Kart, the president of our association, who designed the project. me. the participants themselves, the inhabitants also decided for example of the choice of fruit species that we were going to plant. For example, at the level of management, the inhabitants manage the orchard from end to end. So we have numbers that are talking. For two and a half years, we have organized 201 participatory works that gather 1,444 participants and 19 scientific workshops with more than 250 participants. And finally, at the scientific level, the volunteer inhabitants, which I sometimes call the Benelovs, are formed by protocol. They collect data on the knowledge of trees, fauna, There are nearly 20,000 individuals who have been identified. And biodiversity. And their role evolves because they become referent inhabitants today. They are able to host sessions, to collect data. They pass from a volunteer status to a co-referent. And that's important because they begin to be able to validate data with or without researchers. And that's absolutely brilliant.

• Speaker #1

  Can you tell me how we manage to motivate these inhabitants to participate in this type of approach?

• Speaker #3

  Our qualitative surveys, with long interviews that we have administered to some volunteers, which we consider to be pioneers, who have been coming for a long time, who are often present. And then also our open-ended questionnaires, which we have more widely disseminated to all of our participating inhabitants. revealed to us that motivation does not come from a single factor, but from a contribution, from a combination, if you will, that we called a sense investment. So this sense investment, it comes from the fact that, for several reasons, it has several causes, if you will. First, in fact, the project allows to develop a strong social link and to fight against isolation. First of all, because we have a lot of volunteers, especially retirees, who come to be part of a collective and to break the isolation. A participant even told us, it's a place where time slows down. So it's pretty cool. There is also what we call the dimension of care, of care. Because taking care of nature and others, it's a powerful engine and often carried by women who are very numerous in our volunteers. Learning is also important for motivation and also change of perspective. Participatory sciences allow us to discover the living in another way. And recognition too. The inhabitants see their contribution valued scientifically and concretely by data collection in particular. And finally, if you want, it's the key and the diversity of the activities that we offer. The construction sites, the scientific workshops, the convivial moments. It allows us to welcome various profiles, neophytes to experts, and we also observe volunteers who question their professional future. The project can therefore bring them in multiple ways, many facets and many ways, in fact, to motivate them, to give them meaning, and then to be together on a project that we carry at the back of our hands.

• Speaker #1

  To go beyond what worked, can you tell me what were the big challenges related to this project, the challenges you encountered?

• Speaker #2

  For ecology, the major challenge was to build tools that allow users to work as an extension of the researcher. for example To determine the soil fauna, we had to develop a determination key of the animals that are present in the soil, which uses simple terms, which relies on items easy to identify. For example, the determination keys that exist sometimes use the form of the metatarsus, whether convex or concave. These are things that the knower can do, but not the profane. So, suddenly, We rebuilt these tools in order to rely on much more obvious things, for example, the number of stems. And then, a little more for the flora, it required to calibrate the tools of IA that we used according to the flora of the orchard. We worked with Innaturalist, but Innaturalist, he doesn't guess by magic that this branch of grass is Avena barbata and not Avena sterilis. If he knows, it's because I, in advance, I taught him that In this particular place, it was Avena Stereidis who was present. So, on my side, I had a whole part of work as a backup, which was necessary, not only for me, since the key to the determination of the bestioles was rather the people from the soil fauna who developed it. So all these tools, it took to develop them. We weren't sure that it would work and that it would produce a research quality data, but in the end, yes, it works very well. For example, for the analysis of the flora, I compared the work of the user groups to me. And in fact, they work better than me, they are faster than me because they are more numerous and they have a similarity rate in the analysis which is quite comparable to mine. So they, as they are much more numerous, they move faster and they do it more often, they are much more available than me too. And the result is quite comparable. So we are really well in a tool that works. But to elaborate... It was a first for me, so I wasn't 100% sure, but it worked very well.

• Speaker #3

  Yes, because among these major challenges, like Véronique said, these data collection elements are also done as you go, by coming to the field, by talking to volunteers, etc. Is it simple? Do you think it works well? And again, the key to determination is available on our website, VVoom, in the Open Data tab, if anyone wants to be able to test the flower of the orchard. So there were several major challenges. We had the technical complexity, to manage simultaneously, in addition to different plots, we have a plot in syntropy. We have a plot in agroforestry, we did not want to specifically specify, and then we have spontaneous or fresh prairies. And there, in addition, these different spaces must be made accessible to non-experts, knowing that it is super interesting to have different types of proposals. So that's cool, but it's technical and it's complex. We must also favor what we call the balance. autonomy and rigor. How can you give autonomy to volunteers while guaranteeing the scientific quality of the data? So it's a constant balance that requires support, but support that wants to be benevolent. Well, we've succeeded. But sometimes, when we want to develop interdisciplinarity, it's also necessary that the person who will arrive is humble and cool. Bye.

• Speaker #2

  I think it's not up to all researchers, without criticism. It's just that some need to have a well-identified material, and others will be able to spend a little more time on it. In this case, this project happened at a time when I had a little more time. So I was able to exchange, I was able to be more reactive, and that's maybe also why it worked. But I think it's not... Not all fields are necessarily ready for it, not all researchers are necessarily ready for it, not all research questions can necessarily be addressed by participatory science. And to take up this participatory science element, which is also part of the other challenges, is to strengthen fidelity.

• Speaker #3

  Because maintaining commitment over the long term is... It's not easy because our trees will take time to grow and produce. And as a consequence, it's the reason why we tried to offer various activities. So I said it, the construction sites, the workshops, we develop the conviviality, the aperitifs, and then we also start working with artists. It's great. And then what we also see, what we consider, and we ask ourselves all the time, but that's all the third places and all the third places that are in this perspective, we ask ourselves about the challenge of governance, which is very important. Because we have to articulate the demands of the resident volunteers, with the needs of researchers, with the needs of the collectivities too, and it's not simple. And yet, it's essential for the sustainability of the project.

• Speaker #1

  Thank you, that was very clear. And now, what are the next steps of the VOOM project? In a perfect way,

• Speaker #2

  we are expanding the method we have developed and which worked well on PosaFruit to other open-air and urban gardens, to other users. We would have to test the method by replicating it, and here we come back to the fundamentals of science. It worked once, okay, now you're replicating. and you redo your experience and you try to see if it works. And if it works, it means that the method works. And if it doesn't work, it means that you have to identify the adjustment variables so that it can work. It's not a question of staying on a failure when you do action research. So, you have to identify the adjustment variables. So, I'm super motivated.

• Speaker #1

  Thank you, Véronique. Thank you, Anne, for being on this podcast. This episode made you want to start a participatory research? Know that the Open Labs of CIVIS are designed to establish bridges between university students and society and can help you to train and build projects beyond borders. See you on civis.eu for more information.