Transcription

• Speaker #0

  A lot of times when people come from a faith tradition, a lot of the principles that are taught is that you're supposed to love your neighbor, right? And so your neighbor could be anybody.

• Speaker #1

  Hey guys, Sam here. Welcome to Nerd Averting Spot. Today's episode, you're going to hear an interview with Lyndall Bedford, a fellow social worker who I think does really interesting and important work. So much of the focus... In the interview and his work is around faith-based trauma, religious trauma. But Lindell does it from the perspective of a person who is still part of the faith community. So often I hear people talk about this topic as someone who has left the faith community or that particular faith community, and Lindell's still part of it and very supportive. He talks about collaborating with community organizations. to help people not exclude other groups because they're not part of the faith. So I think it's just a really powerful interview, and he's such a kind person. So I hope you enjoy listening as much as I did interviewing. Welcome to Nerd Avergent Spot. I'm your host, Sam Marion. My pronouns are he, him, and I am a multiple nerd aversion therapist, speaker, and creator. My work focuses on all things nerd adversity. But my particular interests are in autism, ADHD, learning differences, and learning disabilities. I'm excited. Today's guest is Lyndall Bedford. So, Lyndall, would you please introduce yourself to the listeners?

• Speaker #0

  Yes, for sure. Hi, everyone. My name is Lyndall Bedford. So, I am a licensed clinical social worker. I work in private practice. I also work in higher education. My pronouns are he, him. One of the areas that I really work in in private practice is community development, teaching people how to form communities. I also work a lot with spiritual traumas and abuse as well.

• Speaker #1

  Before we continue, I've got a quick disclaimer. This podcast is for information purposes only and should not be seen as a replacement for therapy, health care, or legal advice. Awesome. Lyndall, I look forward to, in this coming conversation, diving in. uh, to all that a little bit more. I think there's really important topics in all that. So, uh, if you're good, let's, let's dive in with the first question.

• Speaker #0

  Of course.

• Speaker #1

  Same as most people get here. Uh, what has your journey with neurodivergence looked like?

• Speaker #0

  So my journey, I would say what neurodivergence is. So I'm not neurodivergent myself, but I do have a lot of family members who are neurodivergent. And so I'm used to kind of just talking with different family members who have been in just different spaces where they may have not felt accepted or wanted or feel like they kind of had to hide who they were. And especially to just like I told you earlier, I work in a space where I work with a lot of clients who've gone through a lot of just spiritual traumas, especially in like church communities in those spaces. And I've seen a lot of that happen as well with friends and families who have kids and maybe even as adults who are in those spaces. And again, sometimes just don't feel like that they belong. And so that's always been kind of my experience, just talking with them and being the best advocate I possibly can.

• Speaker #1

  Got it. Thank you for sharing that, Lyndall. Will you share? And I may be getting ahead of myself a little bit here, but how often do you see that intersection of kind of the need for the community development and sort of seeing that need around neurodivergence?

• Speaker #0

  Yeah, I mean, I feel like I see that intersection or just the need for that a lot. There are a couple of spaces that I'm a part of where they actually have conversations about people who are either neurodivergent. or even people that may come from like disability communities. And we're always kind of having that conversation about, again, just people feeling a little bit more welcome in those spaces or not looked at as their burden, which I never fully understood that because we're all people and people are just amazing. And so I see that happening a lot. And then in some spaces, I don't see it being really talked about at all. And so I think that's kind of also another thing where it's like it's it's there and that intersection needs to happen. But I don't think people really know how to make that happen or know how to have the conversation.

• Speaker #1

  You know, that makes sense, especially if we're talking about sort of. in-person, you know, versions of this, right? So I feel like so much in the neurodivergent space now, there is community development, but it is all virtual, or it's primarily virtual, and how to find a connection, a community where you can sit down with the person, right? Not just connect online. And so I think that's such a powerful thing. But I want to keep moving here, Lyndal. Next question, because I'm excited. I think it's such an important topic. The next question, we're headed here. Many of your clients have experienced spiritual or religious trauma. What do you wish more people understood about the impact of that kind of trauma on people's mental health?

• Speaker #0

  Yeah, I feel like that's such an important question because one of the things I wish people would understand, first off, is this whole concept of faith, right? Whatever it is that you believe in kind of from that faith perspective, I think especially too, because I know for me, I come from a Christian faith background. And so a lot of times people will say that, well, if I'm going through some type of mental health crisis or some mental health issue, then I have a lack of faith or I'm not good enough within my faith. And I wish people would understand that that is definitely not the case. And I think a lot of times people hear that more and more and don't necessarily know what to do with that. And over time, that causes even more mental health struggles like depression, anxiety, and just a lot of self-doubt and lack of confidence as well.

• Speaker #1

  Where do you see that line between a person saying, I think this is my lack of faith versus a person being told this is your lack of faith?

• Speaker #0

  Hmm. You see that more, again, I guess, within the communities that they're a part of, right? So one of the things that I try to especially encourage with my clients is, well, who are you as an individual person, right? Let's start with that, right? Maybe you have a specific spiritual or religious background that's really important to you, and you maybe find as kind of a foundation of how you live your life, right? So let's start with you as that individual and get to know you from that individual standpoint. One of the kind of disconnects and kind of where I see that happen is when people will get into communities first and people will tell people what they should and how they should be as that individual person. And then again, when they don't meet that person's expectations, a lot of times that crisis can kind of start coming up or. There's this idea of, well, maybe I'm not good enough or maybe my faith isn't good enough because this individual or these group of people told me that it wasn't good enough. And we have to remember there's a difference between attacking someone's self-esteem and confidence and also this idea of accountability. Right. There's a difference. And I think sometimes people don't remember or understand what that difference is. And so I think that's where sometimes the disconnect comes in, where people feel. like their faith isn't great enough or maybe they lack faith, right?

• Speaker #1

  Do you see this as more or less common in certain faith communities?

• Speaker #0

  Yeah, I think it just really kind of depends on kind of the structure of maybe that faith community's belief and maybe how they're willing to just bring people into their spaces. Right. I know a lot of times people have specific rules or philosophies on how they run those spaces. So, yeah, I really do think it just depends kind of where somebody is coming into and what type of maybe faith community that they're a part of.

• Speaker #1

  I wonder how much that is also regional as I'm asking that. Right. Yeah, I got I'm in Georgia and I grew up in South Georgia where. I've sort of told people, I grew up, you know, we talk about the Bible belt. I grew up with a buckle of the Bible belt. It's sort of the way I try to describe it to folks. And so I do wonder a little bit just sort of how faith and if we, you know, certain faiths or systems of belief, how they're applied or how they are. practice in certain areas regionally, so much more dominant culture. You know, I went to elementary school where the weekly, you know, assembly was called chapel. The high school, of course, same once a month in different churches around the community. And that was just a normal thing. Whereas, you know, I'm outside Atlanta now. I had people who moved in from the Pacific Northwest to this area, and then they were shocked about how prevalent Christianity was in the schools here. And I was like, wait, hold on here, because I'm in the suburbs. Comparing it where I grew up, this is nothing, because there was a Christmas tree. Yeah. And it never occurred to me that that would jump out. But depending on where you're from, so I don't know, I just sort of— That hit me as you're answering some of that. It's not just maybe, you know, a denomination or certain faith, but also regionally and how that is practiced. Is that you're deeper in that world than me, though. So am I onto something with that or is that like, no?

• Speaker #0

  No, I think you are. Like, I mean, even depending on what state you're in. Right. It's, you know, I've talked to clinicians from maybe like areas like in California or maybe maybe they're more on like. Like maybe they're more North or maybe they're more Northeast. And it's definitely I can definitely tell a difference in how maybe certain faith or certain faith traditions are talked about. And so I definitely would agree with that. It's depending on kind of where you're at, because, you know, I'm actually originally from Georgia. So I definitely I definitely get that. You know, I I grew up in a faith tradition that was definitely a lot more strict. The way that it was talked about, you know, you would talk about it in a specific way where it's like, you know, it's very traditional. And so and then depending on like talking to some of my friends who I went to school with and talking to them about their faith traditions, completely different. Like and again, we didn't live so far from each other. But even just that short amount of distance, like and depending on where your community is at. Right. You know, it's different everywhere.

• Speaker #1

  Yep. So we may have just gone on our deep dive, but let's try to keep going here. I'm curious. So, so, Linda, as both a clinician and a leader in community development, how do you see faith-based and community-based supports working together to help people thrive?

• Speaker #0

  Oh, man, I see that constantly. So especially again with some of the faith-based kind of initiatives that we do kind of either in my area or national organizations where they make this a huge priority, right? One, I see it helping many communities by one, again, first addressing that people are people, right? A lot of times when people come from a faith tradition, a lot of the principles that are taught is that you're supposed to love your neighbor. Right. And so your neighbor could be anybody. Your neighbor could be the person that lives next to you. It could be your work, co-worker, whoever that may look like. So, one, having that faith lens of loving your neighbor and then spending time with someone and understanding where people are at within their communities or what their communities may need and not necessarily being the expert of their community. You're allowing them to be the expert of their community, and you're just being a support system for them. So just having those two combinations, it just does amazing work, and I've seen that over and over again.

• Speaker #1

  Do you ever see tensions between secular community-based support groups and faith-based community groups?

• Speaker #0

  Yeah, all the time. it's almost kind of like a Sometimes it feels like a war where it's like there's always these tensions that come up. And a lot of times I understand, but don't understand at the same time, if that makes sense.

• Speaker #1

  Got it. How often does it feel like there's a tension, but everybody's standing on the same side of the battlefield on what we're trying to accomplish? And so it's sort of weird that there's tension alongside us. Is that? Is that an experience that you see?

• Speaker #0

  Yeah, most definitely. I think one of the reasons why I appreciate even kind of some of the mental health field and even talking to my colleagues who may not come from a faith tradition or maybe they think differently than I do or maybe I think differently that they do is because we're just so cordial with one another and we're trying to do the same work. We're just trying to be a support. for our communities and for the people that we work with. And so I see that a lot of times in mental health spaces where, you know, I see a lot more of that collaboration happening. And even kind of where I'm at now in Central Florida, I'm a part of a couple different groups that focus specifically on mental health. And there may be clients or people that they're trying to serve that they feel like I could talk to and maybe be a support for more and vice versa. If I need support or I have questions, I'm always able to go to them as well. So I see a lot more collaborations happening in those mental health spaces and maybe some of the other kind of areas. I can't 100 percent say I do see some of the disconnect, but I think a big. Part in that, or at least a way to address it is we first have to learn how to have honest conversation with one another and mutual respect.

• Speaker #1

  No, that makes sense. So I'm going to keep moving on here. When you think about your work, whether therapy, you know, you talk about higher education, community leadership. Is there one, if you need to tell more than one story, I'm good with it. But any stories or moments that really capture. Why you do what you do?

• Speaker #0

  Yeah, I'll combine this. So part of my teaching kind of therapy experience, right? One of the things about with teaching is I teach social work students. So I teach, I've taught at the undergrad. I'm about to teach in graduate level. And I've seen just a lot of the impact that. students have in their communities or even some of the stories that they bring into the classroom in ways that maybe the way that they grew up or just kind of what their community has gone through. And that has spoken a lot for me to be able to listen more even within the therapy space. And I will say there was a support group that I was a part of that was kind of help leading. And one of the people in that support group asked us, you know, what would you tell somebody who was going through maybe a mental health crisis, whether that, let's say they were having a schizophrenic episode, whatever that looked like, and you literally just sat there and told them to pray about their issue, and that was it. And for some reason, that really stuck with me because, again, especially no matter whether it's teaching, whether it's therapy, community, whatever it looks like, right? Someone has a story. There are a lot of times people are going through situations or issues that they have no control over. And for us to just kind of give a minimal solution to that situation, I sometimes think we do people a disservice. Right. There's so many things that so many resources that we can come together and bring together to help individuals, help communities. But the fact that We don't always give the appropriate resources or we're just so quick to say, oh, well, you just need to do this and life will be better for you. You know, I think, again, we sometimes do people a disservice.

• Speaker #1

  Yeah, no, I agree with that. I'm working on a presentation right now and I about sort of this similar topic. And I realized I made a whole slide that says disclosure. I hate the phrase, trust the process. These things that like we sort of learned or like how to avoid diving into that or just sitting, you know, and keeping it so surface level that I think that depth is so important. And yeah, all those different moments. You know, I suspect if you and I wanted to, we could sit here for the next hour and just swap stories back and forth of impactful moments from our careers. Right. That's sort of, um, that's another thing that stands out to me, you know, you and I, but we're both social workers. And I was just thinking in the last couple of days, different types of things that made me feel like this is why I'm a social worker. You know, before I started recording, I mentioned I had someone reach out in crisis and absolutely was in crisis. And she thought it turned to the social worker, you know, like that's, uh. among other you know things like that so it's uh i think it's just so powerful uh and i'm even when i just think about social work for a second too let's just take it even further you're like our training social workers trains us for things like community development and the clinical work right this is all um so yeah i think it's great the way you're doing so much um it within the field of social work. I think it's so important. So, so, so wonderful. Can I actually, I'm going to dive into that just for a second. The diversity of the work you do. Do you see that as a, that's not a necessity because the community needs it? Is that a, you just love to do different things all at the same time? What drives you doing so many things?

• Speaker #0

  Yeah, I'll be honest with you. So I would probably say that one. There are times where I look and see all the things that I do and I'm like, man, Linda, you got to be crazy for wanting to do all this, you know. And I mean, like you said, Sam, I think. The idea of social work is just so beautiful and the concept of the teachings of social work and just being able to be a support and watch people, you know, watch people thrive in their own communities or find solutions to whatever that they may be dealing with by just being a support and, you know, being able to help them rely on their strengths because I think that's another thing, right? There's so many people who feel like they don't have strengths or they feel like that they don't have resources. And for a lot of that, that that seems like it's true. Right. And so I think with the training of social work, it's been able to show, at least for me, that, no, like I can always be an encouragement to someone and show them like, hey, you do have a strength. Whether the society tells you that or not, you do have a strength and you do matter. And I think that's kind of what continues to drive me in the work that I do. And also too, like I can put myself even in their shoes, right? I've had my own issues that have come up. And I remember being a college student trying to essentially survive, you know? There were moments when I was in college and I had huge mental health struggles and I didn't know if I was even going to make it. I didn't know if I was going to graduate. I didn't know what was going to happen. But I had someone at the college who was willing to be there and literally counsel me and show me that, hey, you have skills, you have resources that I can give you so that you can be successful. And once I was able to go through that process on my own, I was like, man, I would love to just be able to do that for people. And so that took me on my whole journey of just wanting to go into therapy and become a therapist. than... Essentially, someone telling me I should go into social work, which, of course, you probably know, too. A lot of times people don't know what social work is or they only heard the bad things about social work. And so I'm so glad that I was able to unlearn that stigma because I can't see myself doing anything else, honestly.

• Speaker #1

  Yeah, no, I get it. I don't remember exactly how you said it, but, you know, the value of the human being, the strength of each human being, I think is so powerful. And it's, which is, by the way, for those listeners, this is core to our education, like core to our principles as social workers, core to our values. Like this is written in. It's just to see the value in each human life, each human. I think it's such a great thing. So, Linda, I... I really appreciate you sharing today. I think, especially I think that the religious trauma that I think is just, it's an area that is, I think, slowly being talked about in society. And I see a little bit, but nowhere near where it should be. And so I feel pretty confident. There's some folks who listened to this today who resonated with that. You touched on a little bit of kind of some of their experiences. So thank you for sharing that. But for folks who've heard you share and they thought, I'd like to learn more from Lyndall, maybe they want to reach out to you. How can they do so?

• Speaker #0

  Yeah, there's many different ways. Right. So I so I own so I have my own private practice. It's called Community Bridge Counseling and Outreach Services. So they can always check out my website. So it's communitybridgeoutreach.com. So that's my website or. They can always check out my Instagram page, which is Community Bridge Counseling. So anyway, they can go on my website and find my email. They can go on my Instagram page. I'm always posting information on just kind of what we do as a private practice. And also specifically, too, we talk a lot about community loneliness. We talk about, again, some of those religious traumas, always just providing those resources. So. Um, those are definitely ways that they can just kind of see what we do.

• Speaker #1

  Awesome. Little, thank you so much. Uh, I will definitely link those things in the show notes. Uh, and so thank you for being here and for the listeners. Thank you for listening today. Again, I'm Sam Marion. You can find me on Instagram at nerd aversion spot or at Sam Aaron counseling. Thank you so much. Please share this with anybody who you think would benefit from, from hearing Lindo's story today. Uh, give us a like follow, subscribe all of the above. Thank you so much.