- Speaker #0
Why do so many of us feel so frustrated, so scared and bewildered? How can we feel better?
- Speaker #1
Well, for me, Martha Beck.
- Speaker #0
And me, Rowan Mangan.
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Our job is to live according to our deepest truths, even when it means looking weird.
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Join us as we laugh and chat and stumble our way towards a better world here on this podcast.
- Speaker #1
Did we mention laugh? I mean, what's the point of transformation if it isn't fun?
- Speaker #0
So check out Bewildered, the podcast for people trying to figure it out.
- Speaker #2
Do you ever feel trapped by the expectations of who everyone else wants you to be? Do you dream of breaking free from the roles you typically play and finding your true, authentic voice, no matter who it upsets, as long as it makes you feel like you? Well, today's guest will share her journey from good girl attorney to rebellious author and content creator. She'll teach you how she broke free from societal norms to live her truth and how you can too. Welcome to Unleash Your Inner Creative with Lauren LaGrasso. I'm Lauren LaGrasso. I'm a Webby Award-winning podcast host and producer, singer-songwriter, public speaker, and creative coach. And this show sits at the intersection of creativity, mental health, self-development, and spirituality. It is meant to give you tools to love, trust, and know yourself enough to claim your right to creativity and pursue whatever it is that's on your heart. Today's guest is my friend, Leigh Esposito. Leigh is an author. content creator, tarot reader, and leader in the Italian-American community. She's a former litigator and double Ivy League graduate. She's best known for her incredible work as a content creator,
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where she talks all about Italian and Sicilian culture, creativity,
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and life in general, and for her incredible novel, The Godmother, which is a must-read. This isn't Leigh's first rodeo on Unleash. I first had her on a little bit over a year ago. And I wanted to have her on once again because she continues to embody the spirit of creative authenticity.
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And honestly,
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I just love talking with her and I'm always inspired by her. I love that Leigh is not afraid to be her full self or ruffle a few feathers. And I need to learn how to ruffle more feathers. If you do too,
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this episode is kind of releasing the fear of ruffling feathers 101 course.
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From today's chat, you'll learn how to harness vulnerability as your secret creative superpower, Leigh's personal formula for staying creatively energized even when life gets chaotic, how to move past the fear of pissing people off, how to navigate the complexities of your generational trauma and your generational gifts,
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and much more.
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Okay,
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now here she is,
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Leigh Esposito. Leigh.
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I love you so much. We met via a podcast and now you're my real life friend. I just adore you. You feel like family to me and I'm so grateful to have you back on the show. So welcome to Unleash Your Inner Creative.
- Speaker #1
Thank you. I'm so happy to be back and I feel the same. When I see your mom comment on my stuff, I'm like, oh, it's Mama Joanne.
- Speaker #3
So true. She loves you. You're one of the family. You're a LaGrasso and I'm an Esposito.
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That's right.
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We talked because I love how much you share about our culture and Italian culture. And for those that don't know, go and listen to our original episode. We talk all about Italian-American, Sicilian-American culture, secrecy within our culture, Lee's incredible debut book, The Godmother. And there's just so much there. So do that as your precursor and then come back to us. But you've also recently been sharing about creativity and the creative process and like just being out in the world and being bold and finding your authentic voice. And so I'm curious, first of all, you've always just shared from an authentic point of view, but like, how did you start shifting from mostly Italian only content to now I'm going to share this wider breadth of information?
- Speaker #1
It's a good question. I think when I started my Instagram journey and you and I first connected over a year ago, I think. Yeah. It could have been two years.
- Speaker #3
I think it was at least a year, maybe a year and a half.
- Speaker #1
It's a joyful haze. It feels like I've known you forever, but you know, I started out. I wrote a novel that takes place in Sicily. I was really passionate about reconnecting with my culture. And I think my Instagram really affirmed my own journey to discover what the culture was that I had lost through my family's assimilation that I was finding again, rediscovering what their culture would have been at the time that they immigrated to America and also discovering what Italy is today. Now, I've been spending about four and a half years in this place of heavy, heavy immersion. into the Italian and Italian-American culture, what issues are triggering to Italians. They love to come on my account, tell me what triggers them, what issues Italian-Americans really care about. And now a sort of returning to, okay. My whole identity is not being Italian. It's a bedrock of who I am, but my whole identity is not being Italian. And I can't continue to show up on Instagram and talk about only one thing. That's just not how I am. I'm a Sagittarius, okay? We cannot just do one thing. So then I start talking about other things that interest me. And the creative process is also one of the things that brought me to Instagram. Authenticity, you know, having the balls to do stuff, which is hard.
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Very hard. the show wouldn't exist if it was so easy.
- Speaker #1
Yeah.
- Speaker #3
I love that. I mean, I do want to take a sidestep for a minute and I want to get back to you taking this incredible leap because it's so powerful and good for my listeners to hear. Just for anyone that doesn't know who isn't on Italian Instagram and Italian TikTok and all the other places, Italians in Italy, some, a very select group, are very disturbed over the fact that we... are here in America or in Canada or wherever Italians happen to have immigrated to are proud of our Italian heritage and call ourselves Italian. Have you learned anything more about that in the last year? Like, have you gotten to the bottom of that at all? Like what's going on with that extreme anger?
- Speaker #1
It's not only Italians. There's a lot of European colonial countries. I have a friend who's Dutch who says this happens to her too, but I think it's particularly strong with Italians because Italy is a country that is losing its population. Its diaspora is going to overcome its population. And the people who were born and raised in Italy don't have the same viewpoints as Italian Americans, Italian Australians. You know, they've grown up. There's a different ethos. They're brushing shoulders with more of a monoculture. Of course, I'm going to have people saying, oh, but there's so much diversity in Italy. OK, yes, but it's still. a Catholic country. You know, you don't have the same diversity that we have in these other diaspora countries. And so they look at us and they say that you don't represent us. Stop overwhelming us. Like you're drowning out our voice, especially Americans, because America being the seat of entertainment, which spreads our ethos around the world and a lot of countries find overwhelming. I think there's also some stuff about our ancestors tended to have. immigrated to America before World War II and have fought on the right side of World War II. You know, we were the ones who shouldn't have succeeded. We were Southern Italian, the poorest of the poor to even want to go. And yet we came here and we are leading podcasts and writing songs, writing books, being senators, being the first lady. I think there's a bunch of stuff wrapped up in it. And I also think that Americans of Italian descent are the most triggering in the same way that Americans.
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are the most triggering.
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Yeah, exactly.
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I guess I can make some sense out of it, having been born and raised in Michigan, and then I live now in California. And if I have children, they are going to be raised with a lot of Midwest values. And like, they will be, I think, in their soul, Midwesterners. But if they went around saying, I'm a Michigander, I'm a Michigander, I can see some people from Michigan being like, wait, what? No, you're not. You were born and raised in Southern California, but they still are Michigan. It's a really interesting thing. I've kind of come to think that maybe Italian people in Italy think of it that way.
- Speaker #1
Italian American, you can think of Italian as a modifier to the noun American. And sometimes we use Italian as a shorthand because we are in America. So within America, obviously we're American, we're Italian. So people view us as Italians here. I don't. want to claim that I was born in Italy. No offense. I like where I was born. I love being an Italian American. I'm not trying to pretend I was born in Italy. Don't want to be. Love where I was born. Appreciate it. But when you're in an American context, we're sitting here, we're referring to ourselves as Italian American, or we're describing ourselves to the world. We're Italian Americans. The difference is Italians view. If you're going to identify as Italian, if you're going to say that word, you have to be born and raised in Italy and a citizen of Italy. they don't get citizenship by birth. And that's another thing. They have a very fraught citizenship policy right now where people who have lived there and are born there but aren't Italian genetically, maybe came from North Africa, are having a hard time getting citizenship wrongly. I think they should have citizenship by birth like America does as well, especially when the country's getting so small. Italy is not a country that planned for people to come to it. Their immigration laws contemplate people leaving and trying to retain some of those people who left and generally not being invaded. But they are being invaded and they are being tasked, and they have not fully risen to the challenge here yet, of becoming a country like America. where it's like, okay, everybody's not going to look the same way. Some people are electing to come here and want to be part of the culture, but they are from a North African culture or from a Middle Eastern culture, and they have to deal with that.
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You're so smart, Lee. Honestly, we could have a whole podcast about this. We have to move on because I want to get to the topic. And speaking of how smart you are, you did this Instagram post where you talk about credentials and why we're obsessed with having the right credentials, being experts. and I wonder if you could talk a little bit about that because there's a lot there for a lot of people listening.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, it's funny because my first career after college was as an attorney. I was a lawyer and obviously credentials matter. They largely matter if you're going to be an attorney. There is a way to become an attorney in some jurisdictions by doing an apprenticeship. It's kind of an archaic way of becoming an attorney. You can technically do that. Barely anybody does. I think Kim Kardashian is working on that. She could let us know how that worked out.
- Speaker #3
Bless her.
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So credentials are important in the law. But what's funny is I left the law over 10 years ago and people still care that I have the legal credentials. That makes them pay more attention to the things I'm saying. Although, mosey over to my Instagram, I'm really not talking about anything that has to do with law, though certainly I use rhetoric and logic and stuff in the way I present issues. But I'm not speaking about legal issues. And yet people care that I... I'm an attorney. So it's kind of, there's kind of this disconnect. And then meanwhile, I'm speaking about being Italian and I am Italian, but people are going through your bona fides. Do you speak Italian? When was your last ancestor from Italy? You know, and you can go all the way down the line. Who let you in here? That's the whole question. Why, Lauren, do you get to host a podcast? What are your credentials? Lee, who said you could write a book? That post was just about like, you say what you can do. you know, don't commit unlawful practice of medicine or law or something like that. But unless what you're doing requires a credential, you do not require a credential.
- Speaker #3
Yes. So, okay. I'm always curious to get to the emotional undertones and like the inside twisty parts of why people react the way they do. So to go into that psychology for a moment, why is it from a, like a triggered point of view, why do you think. People are always trying to say, like, well, you need to prove your worth. Like, why is it that somebody would trust you more if you're a lawyer or trust somebody more if they're a Ph.D. and want to point out that somebody who has very valid things to say and has their own level of expertise just from living doesn't have a right to do it because they don't stand on this platform of credential?
- Speaker #1
Well, there's two things operating in the Internet sphere specifically. I think it has to do with there's this cacophony of voices. There's a lot of charlatanism. You know, there's people who purport to be able to do this, this and this. And as we said, you can do whatever you want to do. But to have some sense of who you're dealing with can be helpful. You know, I am dealing with someone who has written songs. I am dealing with someone who has raised a child versus am I dealing with someone who 23 hours a day is playing Fortnite in their mom's basement would be a factor of some credibility. The real life thing about it, because this is really way bigger than online, is people who feel that they have not accomplished something or wish they could accomplish what you've accomplished are resentful. It's the malocchio again. I mention this in like every interview. It's the malocchio. What happy person goes around pointing fingers at others and telling them what they can and can't do?
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No one really. Also malocchio for those that don't know is the evil eye and you better watch out and protect yourself from that. It's the Italian evil eye and it is powerful and there are things you can do to save it off and to word against it. Yeah, that's kind of what I was getting at because I look at some of the smartest, most well-spoken people I know and they have maybe a college degree or something, but their expertise comes from their lived experience. So for those people who are listening and they're like, well, I can't do that because, you know, I don't. have that degree. I don't have that credential. I don't have that testimonial from that person saying how great I am. How can they start to own their own version of expertise and share?
- Speaker #1
They just have to do it even if they feel like a complete blathering idiot who has no qualification. They just have to get started. That's it. There's no way. Stephen King wrote his first book at some point. The Beatles wrote their first song. I bet the Beatles'first song sucked, but they had to do it. Just do it. And a lot of people are going to be so excited. A lot of people are going to love your crappy first song or your crappy first book or your worst, you know, your first post or whatever it is.
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And you might even love it because you might not know it's crappy. Like, I feel like I did write some good songs in the beginning, but there were some really bad ones. But I thought they were all amazing because I never thought I'd get to write a song. But I just didn't conceptualize that people did such things. And then when they started flowing out of me, I was so in awe that I was able to do this thing that I had had my life transformed by, that I now had that power and that gift. For the first year, I really was in the honeymoon phase, and I just didn't see any problems with it whatsoever. I was also 23, so my brain wasn't fully developed, and I loved that for me. But I would say if you're listening and you're in this stage where you're feeling like, oh, but I'm not an expert. Oh, how can I do that? I've never done it before. Try to borrow from your younger self the hope and the excitement and the joy from that period of your life if you had it. And also... Maintain beginner's mindset in that like you're going to get better and it's going to feel easier and easier every single time you do it. And you do have something to say. Even the Fortnite person, you know, he could go out and like do a YouTube about the best Fortnite techniques.
- Speaker #1
He's having the last laugh because the real money is in video games.
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Oh, it's wild. People make millions of dollars from streaming themselves just playing video games. We need to do that. That's our next step. What kind of... resistance within yourself, if any, in sharing this new type of content have you come up with? Has there been any for you? And like, how did you get through it?
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I think the hardest thing for me is to put out content that I know will be really strong, but is less likely to go viral because I've had videos that have been very popular and they've brought me a lot of followers and on some sort of a reward Pavlovian principle, that's very satisfying. When I put out something that's about the creative process, so far that has not been the stuff of mine that goes viral. It does modestly well. It's just fine. But when I put one of those out, as opposed to when I say something very provocative and everybody gets in the comments section and starts going after each other, it's really pushing past a need for a more superficial metric of success. Because what are we here for? Are we here to see ourselves in a little video? Not really. I mean, we're here because we're... passionate about talking to people about issues and writing songs and writing books and coaching people and Instagram and all of this is feeds into that. But it's not the point. I mean, I'm not trying to be a TV star. If I'm putting out content that's going to reach people who are relevant to me, people who buy books, people who want to have coaching experiences and tarot experiences, who want to watch a YouTube channel about a woman's journey to write a novel in Sicily, all this type of stuff. That's more important than getting 2 million people to see the video. That's the only resistance I've had. I've also come to understand people are following me, not necessarily because I talk about being Italian. That's what brought them in. But they tend to either like or some percentage hates my personality.
- Speaker #3
I like it so much. The video I think of yours from the past year the most is the coughing video with your son. So Lee put out a video and she's like, there's a reason. why everybody out there has been getting sick. It's the child in your house. And then she did all these slow motion shots of her son hacking his lung out, like not even covering his mouth. And then it cut back to her like doing the warning about what it's like to have a child that's constantly sick and making you sick. And I just love that because it was so relatable and it so showed your sense of humor and creativity. Like I sent it to like five friends. I... watched it over and over and over again. That's true with podcasting. That's true with anything. People come back week after week because they like the host, because they like the personality, because they feel a kinship to your point of view. And what I wish for all of us is to find in our own ways, ways to make money and or express ourselves creatively that just require us to only be ourselves, like our authentic selves.
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Amen. That's the dream.
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That is the dream. This other thing you talk about in some of the creative content you've shared is the fear of pissing people off, how to get over it and even embrace it. Can you share how you came to learn about that and get where you are today, where you actually embrace it versus hiding away from it?
- Speaker #1
Absolutely. I'm happy to share that when I started my Instagram journey, I had about 600 followers. And I posted, you know, maybe once a month. And so what kind of pushback can you get? A picture once a month, once every six weeks. A few friends like it and write little hearts and little fire symbols depending on the picture. And that's it. You start to put out content and it's like entering a very fast, it's like entering the autobahn in a little jalopy. You get out there with your first content and you're on the Instagram autobahn or whatever it is, TikTok, whatever it would be. And all of a sudden, you're catching a lot of flack. There's a lot of people throwing stuff at you. And at first, how it landed for me is, oh my God, so-and-so said I have a giant forehead. Oh my gosh, so-and-so said that I have so much Botox. Somebody said that I pronounce words so horrifically that they wish I wouldn't speak in any language. And at first it's like this dark garden of Gethsemane, like, what, should I even be here? Like, kind of thing that you do. And then you just shake it off and you do it in stages too. It's not like, oh, shake it off and then it's perfect. You have to keep kind of shedding that skin. And so you get to the place of saying, I love myself and I love what I have to offer. And I love these people who meet me out there and want what I have to offer and are sharing in turn. And because of them and the pleasure that I get of interacting with them and sharing, I am willing to take people being infuriated that I would describe myself as Italian or whatever triggering thing I might be doing. And that's it.
- Speaker #3
So what is the process of shedding? You said it happens in layers. Did you do it thoughtfully or did it kind of just occur?
- Speaker #1
Each time it comes up, I would perseverate. You know, so-and-so said this, I would stew over it and try to respond to the comments. My response technique in the beginning, I would be very diplomatic. I think my training as an attorney, I'm reticent to do what many people apparently feel comfortable doing, which is writing horrible things that will remain for all to see. I feel that that's...
- Speaker #3
That was the first law my mom taught me. Never put anything in writing.
- Speaker #1
Don't put it in writing. And so I would write these very diplomatic responses and my responses have gotten more cutting over time. And I've learned to not respond a lot. And I can share a resource that I'm using right now that I'm really excited about.
- Speaker #3
Yes, please.
- Speaker #1
It's a constant shedding. It's like there was this video that was wrote kind of going around about 12 years ago with these kind of Christian people doing this dance to a song called The Renewed Mind. Did you see it? They're doing this really funny, like nerdy choreography. It's kind of like an early 90s. The renewed mind is the key. And they're talking about how to keep renewing your mind in Christ. That's what it's like. You have to keep renewing your mind. And it comes up again. You know, it keeps coming up. Do I really want to keep doing this? Do I really want people to say that they wish I would die? Which like some people will say stuff like, I mean, you know.
- Speaker #3
Oh my gosh. I know. It's just wild to me. Like what people feel not only entitled, but like they even have that. thought. I can't believe a thought like that would come through someone's mind. I feel like we're living in different worlds and universes.
- Speaker #1
It's the car and driver effect of I'm sitting here behind a screen and this person isn't real. I'm just going to say this thing that I would never say to their face and that I really don't even mean. You know, people are just reacting. They're lashing out. And then, of course, we have to you know, we care about mental health. I certainly am a consumer of mental health services. And there are many people who, you know, should be consumers of mental health services that aren't. And they're just kind of acting out whatever passes through their mind without any pause.
- Speaker #3
Totally. You said there's a resource that you use. What is it?
- Speaker #1
I just started using an app called Opal. I'm really excited about this. They're not giving me any money. They should be. I'm preaching the gospel of Opal because what it does is if you put it in deep focus mode and you select the apps that you want to be cut out of, it will cut you out of those apps you cannot get back in. And so what I've been doing is after I post. maybe respond to some comments. I block myself from Instagram for like five hours and I can't get in. I can't see what people are saying. And by the time I get back in, you know, I can respond to some friends, but I don't see, I don't need to be responding to everything. You don't need to stare at every comment someone makes. You should not.
- Speaker #3
Okay. Opal, we can't wait for all the, the funding you're going to bring for all this free advertisement. Yes,
- Speaker #1
Opal, the new sponsor.
- Speaker #4
Yes. Two lives, stories of people who have faced. darkness and how those moments transformed them.
- Speaker #5
He called 911 and that's when I had my cardiac arrest. I was clinically dead for 24 minutes.
- Speaker #4
We all have two lives. The second begins the moment we realize we have only one.
- Speaker #5
When I woke up in the ICU and I'm completely dependent on machines and people, my whole worldview just shifted, like being born into this totally different life where none of the rules are what I thought they were.
- Speaker #4
I'm your host. Laurel Morales. I'm a longtime public radio reporter with a couple two live stories of my own. Every other week, I bring you an incredible story of someone who chose to flip the script to pull themselves out of the darkness and transform. I personally feel drawn to these stories because they've unlocked the mysteries of how I overcome my own darkness. Two Lives. New episodes. Every other Tuesday.
- Speaker #3
Okay, so I wanted to share something with you that happened recently to me. I have not often in my life gone viral because I don't think I say that many controversial things. But I'm starting to, even though I don't think they're controversial, I'm just like... sharing things about creativity, the creative process, continuing to pursue your dreams, and a select amount of people seem to be triggered by it. And Threads, which by the way, if you're listening and you're not on Threads, get on there because I feel like it's one of the few places you can actually grow right now on social media. But Threads has been a place where I've been kind of testing the waters. And I shared this thread about how to create like a rich person. It went... kind of viral. It got like 100,000 views. And at first it was just like slow. I was like, oh, only four people liked it. I feel like this was so good. I spent so much time on it. I guess it was a waste of time. And then it started blowing up. And I found this interesting thing happening inside of me where I'm so used to being in control because my content, it's decently seen, but it's not like this huge thing. Like I know a lot of my community. I know a lot of the people that are commenting, not like personally, but just like. because they're continually engaged with my stuff. And when it started going wider than what I could control, I felt myself wanting to pull it back in. This thing in me happened where I was like, well, wait, wait, wait, it's gone so far. Like, I don't know. I don't feel like I can like bring it back in and like hold it close to me anymore. So that was an interesting thing, number one. And I'm curious to hear your response to that. And then I've got more thoughts.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, my response is I can totally relate to that. I did a reel, my most viral reel, I had 4.4 million people watch me do a random reel where I said that one of my passions is thinking about what I'm eating for dinner starting first thing in the morning. 4.4 million people saw me say that and it's continuing to roll in. But that very well could have been seen by only 10,000 people. And so you don't know what's going to go out there and people are going to first encounter you through one thing you said. That might have just been riffing or just experimenting with an idea. And I've definitely had things go viral. And I pulled a couple back if they were something where I was like, I really don't want a million people getting into this with me. Not a lot. I have like 700 posts. I've probably pulled back maybe two where I was like, I just, I can't take all this that this is doing. But I totally relate to that. It's scary. You don't know what people are going to glom onto.
- Speaker #3
Yeah, I can't. quite put my finger on like why I had that feeling of wanting to draw it closer back to me but there was like a cool thought it's like a real life example of what it feels like when artists talk about like well once you write the song it's part of the world like it's a world song now and it's like a very visual example of oh this is not about me anymore like people are taking it and doing what they want to do with it and it was I stand by everything I said in it so I don't feel like I want to delete anything but it's just It was like a really interesting feeling in my body that is like, well, I can't control this anymore. If that's in me, I wonder if that's coloring everything I do. And I want to let go of control so more things can be with the world.
- Speaker #1
Again, this is a constant process of shedding those things. So, you know, you have a smash hit song. You're going to have tons of people who love it and you're going to have detractors. And then you're going to get through that. And then you're going to be on Oprah and you're going to have this. and that and all these things are going to happen. And each step is, you know, another level up on the ziggurat of like, here goes Lauren on her journey. And it's normal. You can't we are not born comfortable with hundreds of thousands of people seeing something we said.
- Speaker #3
Yeah, it's actually quite bizarre. So bizarre with like responding to negative comments. How do you know? Because what I used to do is also be very diplomatic. And I would like be so kind and just explain where I was coming from and like send them love. But there were a few comments that I got on this. I'm like, this person clearly just wants to stir the pot with me. I'm not going there with them. They're like saying blatant lies. It's fine. I'm just going to leave it alone. Like, how do you know when you need to defend yourself versus just let something be?
- Speaker #1
When I see a comment that's really standing out to me as generally egregious, I will respond to it. to have on record a response to all of the energy that's going to aggregate there. Because there'll be certain objections to anything you say, and it's just, it shows up under different Instagram handles, but it's people that all have the same critique.
- Speaker #0
And I will put something up there or I will clarify something to just have it there. I will not get into a back and forth anymore. If you see me get into a back and forth, it could be day 24, 25 of my cycle. Stand clear. Just watch yourself. But it's really not what I advise, getting into a tit for tat with people. There are people that you could show them ironclad proof. You could hand them the tablets that Moses took down from the mountain and they'd be like, that's not it. I put things up to be on record. So that when people are going through the comments, which God bless them, a lot of people go through all the comments, they can see my response. And it's just on the record there. Or I ignore it.
- Speaker #1
When you have a hit, you know, like you have that video that's 4 million views. Do you feel undue pressure for the next video to be this hit? Like, how do you avoid just trying to think from like, what will be a hit versus like what you genuinely want to say?
- Speaker #0
That's a great question. I think right after the hit. You're excited and you're on fire and you feel like you're going to get more stuff like that. And you're kind of in that mode. And I don't know how the algorithm works, but you'll tend to get some other fairly high performing stuff around that time because Instagram gets excited and it thinks, you know, this person's producing something that people like, so we're going to promote it. But then for me, it just sort of evens out again. I don't want to have a series of videos talking about, you know, what I'm going to have for dinner. I mean, it was cute. It was funny. It's really the way I think.
- Speaker #1
I love that one so much. It's just. so true. I do wake up in the morning. I'm thinking about it right now. I'm starving, honestly.
- Speaker #0
I am too. I'm so hungry.
- Speaker #1
We should just eat for the rest of the time.
- Speaker #0
Unleashing your creativity and eating.
- Speaker #1
Well, it's true though, because like admitting to your hunger, like these things are all connected, like admitting to your hunger, admitting to your desire, admitting to your like full, like life force energy and ability to create. They're all. one. And I think there's so much deconditioning that needs to happen as a woman to admit how hungry you are for life.
- Speaker #0
Yes. A lot of people, there's different voices with regard to hunger. I am the person among my friends where my friends literally say, Lee, I can't even think about dinner right now. I'm just repeating what I said in the video because this is like, this is my true message. I don't understand what you mean. You are not expected to be hungry now. Think in advance of you in the future. What is she going to want? We care about her.
- Speaker #1
What do we have to look forward to if we don't know what our dinner will be? Oh,
- Speaker #0
my father said the other day, which was a lie, he said, I don't live to eat. I eat to live. And I was like, A, you're lying. And B, I don't relate to that. It's all about food for me. Like my whole life, all the things I want to accomplish is like so I can go to better restaurants.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, seriously.
- Speaker #0
Have the best olive oil.
- Speaker #1
Oh, my gosh. The dream. When you're coaching someone and they're working on all these things we're talking about, especially on. finding their authentic voice and not being afraid. Because I think fear and fear being in the driver's seat of our lives is such a big thing that holds people back from expressing themselves in creativity. Like if someone's listening right now and they find themselves in that position, where do you start with them to orient them onto how they find and start to find their voice and share it?
- Speaker #0
I have a belief that action defeats anxiety. So you just take a step. I start to get them into practicalities. I start to ground them because they're kind of up here. They're in the astral chakra. They're off here with what could happen and what everyone's going to think. And they need to get down into the roots and the nuts and bolts of like, okay, what did you like doing when you were a kid? What is it you're really thinking about right now? So many people have so many talents. And again, they don't feel that they don't have the credentials or they haven't been doing it all the time. They drifted away to be a mom or a girlfriend. to do a corporate career. So if I get them out of analyzing why they should or shouldn't do it and just get them into brainstorming and just refuse to let them gatekeep themselves, they just have to brainstorm and they get into it. And then it's, and this is why coaches are so helpful. It's like, okay, and then what steps are we going to take before the next session? And then they're just, you know, even though they are inventing, they are not working for someone, they are inventing something because they're partnering with me. They are. given a structure where they don't feel like they're alone. There's accountability and someone's keeping them moving so that it's not so amorphous and hard to manage.
- Speaker #1
And if someone's like you were 10 years ago where, you know, you've got this great job, it's a job that people loud and, you know, admire, but they know in their soul that it's really not for them, that that doesn't encapsulate who they really are and what they want to share with the world. Like when you're coaching someone through that, how do you get them from that fear of how I will be looked at? to how I want to feel and who I want to be day to day?
- Speaker #0
Primarily, people look at the practicalities. They say they're so unhappy, but they can't figure out how to get out of what they're doing. So if it's law or accounting or marketing, whatever it is. What I tell them to do is find a rich benefactor. Just kidding. I'm not kidding, actually. That's awesome.
- Speaker #1
Well, that was part of my tweet. It was like, all these rich people aren't paying for their own work. They get people to pay for their work, for their creative work. So we do need to think about that. We need to think about grants. We need to think about GoFundMes. We need to think about, are there angel investors? Is there anyone you know who has extra money, who hasn't pursued their dream, but would love to help you pursue yours? Like, there are ways. Yes, it's hard, but it's also hard going broke doing what you love.
- Speaker #0
Yeah. And you can give people, you know, rich people love this. You can give them a piece of the action. You know, if you sponsor me while I'm working on this album, you get 10% of royalties, whatever. It's right. You just kind of do it. And then you I'll talk about you on my podcast. And if I win a Grammy, you're my date. Just think the people that you know who have money. And when you encounter people with money, go out and talk about it like you're already doing it. Yeah, I'm an accountant. And. I'm a children's book author and I'm working on a piece right now, blah, blah, blah. And you just talking about it and you are going to draw the rich benefactors and the publishers and the people who want to read your book. If you don't have a financial scaffolding to just leave abruptly, you have to start taking steps and holding yourself out as it. Because sitting there at your desk and saying, I hate to be a lawyer, ain't going to get you out of that desk.
- Speaker #1
Yeah. And I can truly say everything I've ever gotten, every dream that's ever come true. has been because I said it out loud to people. And those people co-created with me and helped make it happen. You know, the way I got to LA was I started telling everybody in the theater department I wanted to work on The Ellen Show as an intern. And I was in Michigan. I was in Michigan State. It's in the middle of Michigan. No one knew anyone. But someone did. My friend Brandon knew the girl who was a production assistant there. And by the time I applied, happened to move up to production coordinator. who happened to be the person who hired the interns. So that just happened from saying what I wanted very clearly to anyone who would listen. And it's scary to do that, but also it's scary to not.
- Speaker #0
Well, and that's what magic spells are. They're words, not just words, they're words. I think abracadabra comes from an Arabic expression. It's like abracadabra, like it's basically that. It's just magic words, declaring yourself. It really makes sense. How are people supposed to know what you want if you don't tell them? I mean, it's not it's not just like that, you know, the book, The Secret, where, you know, you think about a bicycle and it'll appear. I mean, some of it's a little bit nuts. But if you say, like, I really want a red bicycle for ten dollars and you tell a bunch of people and somebody says, oh, my cousin has a bicycle that's sitting in their garage, it's red. Hey, would you sell to this girl for ten dollars? You know, it all comes together because you said it.
- Speaker #1
Yeah. And also something that I've been thinking about a lot lately is. I feel like I spend a lot of time like thinking about what I want and then being like, why don't I have it? Why don't I have it? But I don't spend enough time feeling into what I want, which is, you know, that's something that people in manifesting will talk about a lot. But all I do is think about how hard it is and how much I want it and how much I don't have it. Instead of thinking about, oh my gosh, once this would happen, this is how it would feel in my body. This is how it would feel with my family. This is how it would feel in my community. This is how it would feel to like share it with people. Less time in like the brain and more time in the feeling of what it is we desire.
- Speaker #0
Take some actions towards that. Open up your voice memo and have a fake call to your mom to announce the exciting news that you just got, whatever it is. Oh my God,
- Speaker #1
mom.
- Speaker #0
Oh my God, mom. They just got signed for a five record deal.
- Speaker #1
Oh my gosh.
- Speaker #0
And Oprah wants me to be on her. It's always Oprah for me. I always want to be with Oprah.
- Speaker #1
Yeah.
- Speaker #0
Oprah wants me to run. a whole show on the own network, you know, and just do the whole call, like literally. And then you can even have your mom go, oh my God. Be like, yeah. And just act out the whole call. That's how you feel it. You have to act it out.
- Speaker #1
Anytime I've done that, it works because God bless it. If nothing else, you feel so amazing for the day or the time that you're doing it. You're like, wow, I'm walking on air. My dreams are coming true. And a lot of time I'd say, usually if you stay committed to that. it does end up working in some capacity, even if it's a little different than what you thought.
- Speaker #0
I agree.
- Speaker #1
Speaking of like calling my mom, we're very lucky that, you know, your dad's so supportive. I've got such a supportive mom. We've got great families. But there are always people in your life or even in your family sometimes, sadly, that you feel, well, if I say this, they're going to judge me. If I tell the family secret, they're going to judge me. And you had this great reel you did where you talked about, well, if you want to... you know, get to the bottom of the family thing. If you want to confess a family secret, write about it in your book. Nothing will ever be more secret than that. Could you talk a little bit about that? Because I think it's so important for people who are afraid specifically of their family's judgment.
- Speaker #0
Yes, here's the sad and liberating truth. Everybody in your life, they don't care what you have to talk about. They hear you all the time. They don't want to read your book. Some of them do, but it's a minority. They do not want to read the book. They do not want to watch the show that you were on. They might be jealous. They are used to whatever narrative you're advancing. They might be afraid to read it and see how bad it is, and then they wouldn't know what to say, or they might be afraid to read it and see how good it is and feel inadequate. Whatever the case, people who don't know you or don't know you that well or are just beating you have absolutely no problem reading your book or listening to your song or watching your podcast. But people in your family and close friends very often do. So if you want to say something, I have clients with us say, oh my God, I'll be so embarrassed when my grandma reads this paragraph. She's not going to read it, especially if it's after chapter two. She ain't getting there.
- Speaker #1
Yeah. She'll be like, honey, I love the... book. Oh my gosh, that one part. And it's going to be like the first three paragraphs. That's how you can always tell somebody hasn't read something or listened to something when they only remark about something at the very beginning.
- Speaker #0
Oh, I have people say, oh, did the godmother end up with that guy? What guy? There's no guy in the book. There's one paragraph where the godmother sees a hot guy. That's it. So they must have flipped through and found that paragraph. Yeah,
- Speaker #1
that was what they focused on. Yeah.
- Speaker #0
It's hard to admit that you haven't read someone's book. So it's like, and it takes a while to read and everybody's not a reader or there's such a buildup of content coming at people. So whether it be an album, a song, a movie, a show, a musical review, a book, people have so much coming at them that there's a lot of resistance. And then they just, family can be challenging. Maybe it's especially Italian families.
- Speaker #1
Well, because we talked a lot about on the first podcast we did together, and I bring it up all the time, but the secrecy within Italian families. And I think our generation in particular is really bringing a lot of those secrets out. And I think especially for the older generations or for even those that are out there that are millennials or Gen Zs who are of a more traditional mindset, it's challenging. But also like the song, one of the songs that I'm putting out in the next year, it's all about this. And I. have a line in there. I go, who are we protecting? Do we whisper for the dead? And a lot of times the answer is yes. Like we're still protecting secrets. And again, I feel comfortable saying this because anyone who cares doesn't listen to my podcast, but we're still, for some reason, protecting the secret of the fact that my grandma was abused by her mother and, you know, her mother had mental health issues. I don't know how long ago she died. I think it was in the eighties. So almost 40 years later, we're still protecting the secret. Why?
- Speaker #0
There's definitely an omerta. You know, we're both Southern Italian. We have Sicilian heritage. There's the omerta. There's the don't tell anyone your business, whether good or bad. You know, it's also can be hard, you know, if you love that person, if there was something to love about that person who made those mistakes or did those things, or you have grace for them, you could be reticent to, you know, inform all these people of what they did wrong. But at the same time, you are the one who's alive, who's still dealing with, you know, if this happened, you received it too through the family line.
- Speaker #1
The only trickle down economics I believe in are epigenetics and inherited trauma. That wasn't talked about.
- Speaker #0
That's right. My great grandfather, who was Neapolitan, orphaned on the streets of Naples in the early 20th century, gassed in the hills of Italy during World War I, fighting for the Italians before he came over. And. had physical abuse things that he did towards his family. And then that trickled to my grandfather and to my father and, you know, the real, and my father did some of it and then stopped when I was little, but I got spanked really badly when I was little. And my dad, to his credit, I think this is really powerful. He completely owns it. He's like, I made a mistake. He went to anger management, never happened again. And then I have not perpetuated that, but look at how long it took. We are now. 124 years after the initial person had all that trauma. And I mean, I don't know who the real initial person is.
- Speaker #1
Right. Like we don't know where it even started. I don't know. I'm curious what you think about this because I hear a lot of people being like, well, I was the first one to step out of my generational line and I'm the one healing the bloodline. And I'm like, I get what they're saying. And it is hard to be that person. But exactly who else was supposed to do it? The person who was fighting for their life? I'm not saying it was right. They shouldn't have done what they did. But maybe what if we're all doing exactly what we're supposed to do for our karma? I don't know. Is there a chance of that? And is there a chance that everybody did the best they could even when it wasn't good?
- Speaker #0
They definitely did the best they could. I was a beneficiary of, you know, my father had that inherited trauma. There was on his side of the family, there was a lot of that. And for my mom, she wasn't raised with really any corporal punishment or any of that stuff. You know, they had their own stuff. I mean, they were certainly they had like explosive tempers and stalking away from the table and yelling, but she didn't have that. And I think that being raised. So I was primarily raised by my mom. My dad traveled a lot for work. And, you know, when he did have those incidents. He wasn't even home enough to really have it happen at the time he was traveling so much. And then he stopped when I was young. So it wasn't modeled for me as much because I was really fortunate to have my mom's influence. And she really influenced all of us. My dad credits her for helping him stop the cycle right there. I think if you're somebody who's the direct recipient of that, so I didn't really receive it as directly as my dad did. My dad received a lot of physical stuff. I think it's probably pretty hard to step out of it. I think you almost need like an interrupter, like how my mom kind of interrupted that. I think I know everybody's doing their best. And even each generation was an improvement. My grandfather improved on his father. My father improved on his father. So they all improved. And the dark truth of being a parent is that you don't become an ascended master. You know, you still screw stuff up.
- Speaker #1
And so rude.
- Speaker #0
Yeah, it sucks. I mean, I told my son that the other night. I was like, here's the surprise. You know, mommy's not perfect.
- Speaker #1
Yeah. Sit down, gather around. I have a story for you.
- Speaker #0
This is the one you got. You know, here's what I have that's great. And here's what I have that's not great. And it's...
- Speaker #1
Do you know how healing that is though? Because I think growing up, my biggest thing was I was a really sensitive kid and I could tell when things weren't right, but no one was talking about it. And the fact that you have the self-awareness and the self-love and the love for your child to tell him the truth. which is what you're working on and that you're still trying your best and you love him very much, that makes him know that it's not his responsibility to fix.
- Speaker #0
Yes. And I actually really did get that from my dad. You know, my dad was really great about affirming my perspective that I perceived things to be hard, that certain behavior that he had. And he never shied away from talking about it to this day. He will say it. I'm in mixed company. If I bring it up, he will just own it. And I think that. that's really important as a parent. You know, I'll sometimes ask my son because I'm divorced. So when he's with me, he'll complain about his dad a lot. And I'll be like, all right, let's flip the table around. What are we saying about me at dad's house? Oh, nothing. You're perfect. I'm like, what is it? And I'll get him to say some stuff. And I'm like, OK, let's hear it. I do not expect you to love everything. Tell me because maybe it's something I can improve on or maybe you're wrong and I'll explain why you're wrong.
- Speaker #1
It's just like the comment section. Nothing has prepared you for being a content creator like having a son?
- Speaker #0
Yes. Tell me in the comments. That's what I say to my son.
- Speaker #1
Go ahead. Subscribe, rate, review. I don't know. My issue with being like, I am the one that healed things, which yes, you are. And we stand on the shoulders of those who also healed things, even when it didn't look like healing because it wasn't as explicit for them as it was for us. And I do hold both. I hold like my great grandmother did. terrible things that never, ever, ever should have happened. And I have a tremendous amount of compassion for her. I will always wonder my whole life what she went through that made her behave that way. And I know something horrific happened to her. And for my grandmother, that she stopped the cycle of abuse without any mental health help is unbelievable. And like, she is my hero. I have chills right now. I feel like they're here with us.
- Speaker #0
They are. It's so sacred. My relationship with my mom's parents was like, that's how I know what God's love is. Didn't matter what I did. They didn't even really care about, I mean, my grandfather was real proud of me for going to law school. I could say my grandmother did not care if I worked or did anything, accomplish anything. She just was so excited like that I was breathing. She's like, yes.
- Speaker #1
Yeah. They're a reminder that who you are is the best thing about you. Oh my gosh. We could go in so many different directions.
- Speaker #0
I know.
- Speaker #1
I love you. And tell me, you've got a bunch of exciting things happening right now. Tell me about what you've got going on and how people can get involved.
- Speaker #0
Yeah, so my Instagram continues under Ms. Leigh Esposito. I'm launching a YouTube channel, Leigh Esposito. I have my novel, The Godmother, also by Leigh Esposito. Go figure. That's funny how that works. And I also do coaching. I read tarot, which is something I learned in writing my novel. I'm writing my next novel. So you want to get on my mailing list and find out about that because obviously it's going to be. The biggest thing since Gone with the Wind. So that's it. All my crazy stuff that I'm doing. And then hopefully you'll be hearing me more on here with the best podcast host in the world.
- Speaker #1
Oh my gosh. I love you so much. Thank you for everything you do and for always encouraging us all to be ourselves and to own all parts of us, to remind us that all parts of us are welcome here and that they should be freely expressed. I just think you're the best and the smartest and the coolest person in the world. And I'm glad you're my friend. Love you.
- Speaker #0
I love you too.
- Speaker #1
Thank you for listening and thanks to my guest, Leigh Esposito. For more info on Leigh, follow her at MsLeighEsposito and visit her website, leighesposito.com. Thanks to Rachel Fulton for producing this episode. Follow her at Rachel M. Fulton. Thanks to Liz Full for the show's theme music. Follow her at Liz Full. And again, thank you. If you like what you heard today, remember to rate, review, and follow the show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Share the show with a friend and post about it on social media. Tag me at Lauren LaGrasso and at Unleash Your Inner Creative, and I will repost to share my gratitude. Also tag the guest at Miss Leigh Esposito so she can share as well. My wish for you this week is that you find the courage to share your most authentic self and story, no matter how vulnerable it might be or who might see it. Embrace the power of your unique voice and let it transform and inspire the world. I love and believe in you. I'll talk with you next week.
