- Speaker #0
Even when I was in Hollywood and I was like just starting to build my freelancing career, I was always like evangelizing about it to other people. I'm just like, guys, like we don't have to work for minimal wage. There's actually people on the Internet that like value our skill set. Like, this is crazy. Whereas like it's so cool that like I'm able to travel and just be like this place. I'm not going to move here after all. I'm going to keep on traveling or like I think I'm going to be here. Just kidding. We're going to Portugal. I think that that like ability to try to have a lot of messy action and try things out. I think it's like the beauty of travel because you try on identities and places and environments and friends and then decide wait yes to that no to that and then this is working but this isn't I think that that's the true gift of travel is also understanding yourself in a deeper level I think Greece was actually amazing which fast internet like nice like some pretty affordable airbnbs in certain parts of the city like you have to be a little careful with what neighborhoods you pick but I think that like the food was just exceptional I think a lot of tourists skipped to Athens or just use it as a jumping off point for the islands but you're close to just some really beautiful places and food.
- Speaker #1
Welcome to the Wing It Travel podcast with me James Hammond. Every Monday I'll be joined by guests to talk about their travel stories, travel tips, backpacking advice and so much more. Are you a backpacker, gap year student or simply someone who loves to travel? Then this is the podcast for you designed to inspire you to travel. There'll be stories to tell, tips to share and experiences to inspire.
- Speaker #0
Welcome to the show.
- Speaker #1
Hello and welcome to this week's episode where I'm joined by Amy Souto who is a full-time digital nomad writer and author of her current book Nomad Detective which we'll talk about today. She is also an avid traveller. She began her career as a Hollywood TV writer and is now helping people become freelance writers like herself. So we're going to talk about all that today and some maybe some favourite travel destinations for digital nomading but also just for personal travel. So Amy, welcome to the show. How are you doing?
- Speaker #0
I'm doing great. Thanks so much for having me, James.
- Speaker #1
Please tell the listeners where you are, and it's a pleasure to have you on.
- Speaker #0
Yeah, I am in the beautiful island of Madera, which we talked about a little bit because you've been here before too. And it's just gorgeous. Even though it is the end or middle of September, it's still swimming weather. I was in the ocean all day yesterday, just like going for an afternoon swim. It's sunny and beautiful and the produce is amazing. farmer's market has all these exotic fruits like it's beautiful how was the flight in because it's notorious for difficulty landing right yeah it was totally fine i watched all of these like i doom scrolled like the tiktok videos of people being like this is the most dangerous airport in the world and you will definitely crash and die i'm like excellent perfect but our flight in here from london was actually very stress-free nothing bad happened so that's good yeah same it was pretty uh
- Speaker #1
harmless in the end. But you have seen those videos, haven't you? Because the crosswind plane is literally on the side, isn't it, going down. It's quite scary.
- Speaker #0
Yeah, yeah, it's nuts. But happily landed safely. But some people that are here, some of the fellow nomads, some of their friends got their flight cancelled because the winds were too strong. So they had to leave and they couldn't land. And so it was really interesting to hear about that. So happy to have avoided all of that.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, I think the pilots have to do an extra training session about Madeira. I think they have to just deal with the crosswinds or at least have that on their CV. So obviously it's a difficult place to land. So I'm glad you made it safely. My first question is, where did you initially grow up and was travel part of your upbringing?
- Speaker #0
Yeah. So I grew up in this small town in Arizona where people ride horses to work. It's kind of like this little suburb with Starbucks on one side and then horse rodeos on the other, nothing. So it was this kind of strange place to grow up. Travel wasn't... totally a big part of my upbringing. We did a lot of road trips to California because California is amazing and it's where everyone in Arizona wants to be, but isn't. Arizona's the worst. So if anyone likes Arizona, good for you. I do not. But I didn't really do a lot of travel, especially not very much international travel growing up. And my first solo international trip was when I was like... 25, I think. And I decided to go to Paris and Berlin on my own and just like, let's go. Like, I'm going to get out of here. And I loved it so much. And then I just kind of kept, I got caught the travel bug and I kept traveling and eventually turned travel into my full-time lifestyle as a digital nomad.
- Speaker #1
Do you think any Americans that do take the dip to Europe, for example, like you did, did they ever come back disappointed? I mean, I do hear a lot, the Americans who do travel for leisure, not for business, just for leisure, and they go to Europe, they do come back and say, I loved it. I've never really heard them say much about they didn't like it.
- Speaker #0
Yeah, I think especially for me, what was kind of crazy is that I, a few years ago, I was diagnosed with an autoimmune disease that I healed through travel, which was really fascinating when I spent two months in Italy. And I came back and had to take a blood test. My doctor's like, what did you do in Italy? And I'm like, I just ate pizza for two months. So yeah, two months straight. I didn't, I wasn't like, not like back in the States where I'm like eating vegan, like just saccharides. I'm like, no, I just ate pizza for two months. He's like, keep doing that. I was like, okay, doctor's orders. I'm going to go just like live in the world and eat pizza, which I can't do in the US. And then eating pizza in Italy and other places cured me. and reversed my autoimmune disease and I got off all my medication and I just completely reversed it and I I strongly believe it's the food quality abroad not just in Europe but not in the US whatever we're doing to our food in the US that's my next point do you think it's just the quality of produce that you get to eat and
- Speaker #1
the reason I say that is because I was at a podcast movement event about a month ago now actually and the first person I bumped into because I don't know anyone there right so you're trying to speak to podcasters and she's a gut health podcaster doctor written books etc and i said to her oh it's funny you should say that because i do have problems with my gut but only really since i've moved to canada she goes well how long ago was that i said like five six years ago she yes the food i'm like shut up the bat oh so you're saying i should go back to europe she goes well you just gotta accept that north american food is not that great so you need to make that decision right i was like oh so you said that as well which is quite amazing
- Speaker #0
and also isn't it shocking yeah well i think that there's i remember reading this medical study showing that immigrants who moved to the U.S., their good gut bacteria decreased so quickly, like within, and like to like in the next generation, it got worse and worse. And so I think it's like, it's definitely the pesticides and like the produce quality, even here when, you know, we went to the organic produce farmer's market here today in Madera, and we picked up like the cutest little grapes that have seeds in them, and they don't look like American grapes. And even like the little bananas here that taste like lions that are amazing, they can't be ex- afforded because they aren't aesthetically what other grocery stores like because they're too small but they're beautiful and delicious and so eating real food in other countries especially when I was in Istanbul and eating their Turkish breakfast with all the produce that are a part of that I was like oh America has got some problems like
- Speaker #1
this is real food this is crazy ate pizza and it cured it I mean that is mental I can't get my head around that you're going to Europe big change was there culture shock was there any
- Speaker #0
thoughts are maybe do you know what i need to go back i think the the thing that really kind of started my digital nomad journey was actually during the pandemic so i had started traveling with a bunch of my friends and we had initially started with just a road trip around the u.s where we rented out all the airbnbs that nobody was using since it was in the middle of covid everyone was still like disinfecting their their amazon packages but by fall and so it was like everyone's trapped inside and we're like we're gonna go to colorado we're gonna get every all of our friends out of you know, Los Angeles and we're going to like rent this big house in Colorado and spend like a month in the woods to get away from all of the insanity. And so we love that so much. My partner Kyle and I and then the rest of our friends, we continued to travel around the US and we stayed in just beautiful places. And then when Europe opened up, we are like, let's go to Europe. And then that's when, you know, the pizza like cured me basically. And like things got like were really was really cool. And so after that kind of first stint, I was like, okay, I want to be a digital nomad. And like full time for the next few years and then we can decide where we want to live because at that point i was exiting hollywood and i wasn't quite wanting to return to my work as a tv writer and so that kind of when the digital nomad lifestyle took out and that's also when i finally started transitioning into my first like few six figure years as a freelance writer and when i started to really kind of see my business blow up and then i also started doing my own creative writing work outside of the industry and that kind of like when everything transitions I think that there's something magical about travel that inspires you and also simultaneously being a minimalist while you travel there's fewer distractions in some ways where you're not having to deal with upkeep of a car an apartment and like things like that and you have less responsibilities you can be more in the moment which I think helps creatively and also helps business-wise when you're just focusing on the work that you're doing and enjoying the moment while you're traveling and working yeah
- Speaker #1
not And up to that point, you mentioned there about your career. So up to COVID and even that trip as well. So you're just like doing the classic career writing in Hollywood. What is that like in terms of a career? I can imagine it's intense, but I only hear that from maybe like, you know, corporate people who say that their lifestyle was intense. It's all about work. Is that the same for writing or is it a bit more ad hoc where it depends what projects come up?
- Speaker #0
Yeah. So I worked my way up from. assistant at an agency, at a talent agency, to eventually being able to write episodes of TV and working with CIA agents on my episode as five thriller, which was very fun. But I think what was really kind of jarring for me is when I got into the industry and I finally started to get the directions that I wanted. was I was looking around at people around me and I'm like, I don't feel like that everyone's very here. And we're all playing pretend and talking about conspiracy theories of the CIA. And we're not having a blast. I'm like, I'm having I'm having more fun working with my freelance writing clients who are flying me out to go write their memoirs. And like, I'm doing these kind of crazy jobs that people are paying me like so much money for. And then I entered it. Hollywood TV world. And then all of a sudden, my skills are being undervalued, people are asking to work for free. And I'm just like, I don't know about this. Like, I think I'm going to go do this thing over here. And so it was kind of in part, like freelance writing work was sweeping me up into this world of like travel and meeting really fascinating people. I started ghost writing memoirs for Olympians and NBA players and really inspiring people around the world. And I was like, this is more fun. And it was kind of a shock because I had grown up wanting to be a TV writer. um and wanting to be a novelist which is what i'm doing now more so but i think with hollywood just the industry is in such a dire place and los angeles is becoming the next detroit and it's like really falling apart and and that's just because of the way that the industry is built and the way that it's not coming to like reckon with like everything that has happened with the streaming the bubble that has burst and there's like so much going on there and it's like people are very unhappy about it and like some bad actors have really ruined a lot of things for people and i think that When the pandemic hit, that was a wake up call for me to refocus on the thing that I was already doing on the side, which was freelancing. And I just put more energy into it. I just saw it take off.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, I think I was going to say at least you had the freelancing on the side. I guess it's more intense or even more worrying if you don't have anything on the side to fall onto. Because obviously, if you're trying to think, I need to get out of this, but there's no way possible. Or you start from scratch. You try to get clients. That's a bit more of a challenge. But the fact you had on the side. you maybe obviously knew subconsciously maybe one day if it does get too much and obviously pandemic come along and change everything but like you could think oh do you know what i could do that freelance and you've obviously figured a way out where you don't have to be location dependent so there must be a pretty big achievement but also relief that you can actually leave that role in hollywood and then go out and do your own thing yeah
- Speaker #0
i think the future is freelance for a lot of people and i think that that's a good thing like i think that freelancing has sometimes gotten like a bad rap and lumped in with the gig economy as like, oh, it's just only low paying and it sucks. But in reality, if you build your freelancing career right, and I actually wrote a whole book on this called Six Figure Freelancer that is kind of breaking down all of the things I wish somebody had like shaken me and told me about how to set rates at an appropriate level, about how to figure out how to negotiate with clients, how to value your skills, how to raise rates year after year, like things like that, that I feel like really kind of created a foundation for my freelancing career that didn't cause burnout because I was burning out again and again and again until I learned these lessons. And I feel like, but once I learned them and everything unlocked, I'm just like, wow, okay, life is really good now. Like I want to share this with other people. And so I made a lot of free content for people. And I'm kind of, I just like, I'm so passionate about it because I see how freelancing allows the kind of security that you don't have in a traditional job when you have like four or five clients instead of one job. then if one client drops or two clients drop, you can always go replace those clients versus if you have one full-time job with one skill set in one specific industry, if that job or that role goes away, then you have to suddenly, all of your income stops and you can go find another job. And then everything kind of feels out of balance. And so I do think freelancing is the future and freelancing and content creation and like combination of different things. I think everybody should be kind of thinking about that if you have that entrepreneurship kind of like
- Speaker #1
hole and like barking you then there's so much cool things to be done yeah I'm definitely like you I'm a bit of a creative hence the podcast and I've got a degree in music right so I'm trying to figure out do you think COVID changed things for you or were you already thinking about it on the way out of changing your lifestyle or do you think that actually was the trigger that got you going yeah
- Speaker #0
I think I talked about this a lot with my partner Kyle and with friends and other nomads we meet I think that the pandemic as horrible as it was really did change our lives in a good direction because I think it and I've talked to some other people who felt similarly where we were forced to like hit pause and you know like reevaluate our lives and go into therapy and like think in like the darkness of the pandemic like what mattered to us and face our own mortality and also understand like what do I want for the rest of my life and so I think that it kind of created this moment of pause where we were all stuck inside and I think that that was kind of a really cool opportunity to reset and and also kind of created, you know, it made me reconcile what my life was and where I wanted it to go. Because before that, for COVID, I was definitely kind of like burning myself out. I was going through like party girl era in Los Angeles that was not healthy. And since then, I've like quit alcohol, quit caffeine, and like completely gotten healthy and changed everything for the better. And I feel like none of that would have happened had I stayed in the same kind of environments, the same circles, the same habits. And so I think everyone was impacted differently by the pandemic, but I think that having that moment to pause for me and the journey that I went to was such a gift in some ways.
- Speaker #1
Yes, the environment, right? You're changing that. That's the big one. I know habits come into it and I guess people and relationships, but the environment. I guess if you keep thinking you're going to change in the same environment, that's quite difficult, isn't it? Imagine you're, I don't know, maybe you don't like your job, but you're thinking, I don't know, I'll change my habits to like the job. It's not really going to work because you don't like it. You've got to be honest, right? I think that's why the group. um would call it the uh the reset or people start quitting their jobs right in in covid because they thought you know what it's not for me and it's amazing it took sort of pandemic like conditions to get that across the people right i do wonder before then were people already thinking it on a lower level but just thought it's no way possible like what's going to change my life to get me going right but obviously a pandemic would do that and obviously it's quite unprecedented
- Speaker #0
James, what do you feel like? Do you feel like your life changed before and after the pandemic? Do you feel like it was stark?
- Speaker #1
It's an interesting one for us because we just moved to Canada the year before, right? And that was on a work permit for two years you get in Canada. And the idea was we're going to live in Canada. We're going to see the West Coast. I'm going to live that lifestyle for two years. And obviously halfway through COVID happened. But then what choice do you have? They started extending permits. We started, you know what, let's try and get residency. So then that changed. That's a new thing I never thought before. Let's get permanent residency. And that's now leading to a passport. So that's different and an option. But also it did make me reflect on my previous travels. So I'm like, oh, do you know what? Traveling is great, but I need to make it long term, not just a short term. And what I mean by that is, yeah, I've done the classic quick job, go for six months or a year quite a few times. And I actually done it afterwards, interestingly, because of burnout, I think. But from that trip last year was... oh do you know what this needs to change but I think COVID played a part a lot of questions are asked yeah I did struggle yeah it was a struggle I don't know what how you felt in terms of being indoors all the time and you know I actually thought I was an indoors person but actually it turned out I wasn't during COVID so that was a that's a new lesson for me as well but I did struggle with that and when your life is travel pretty much like it was at that point for me and you can't do it that's a big problem yeah so a lot of lessons learned
- Speaker #0
I think it definitely also kind of at least for me and the people around me. I feel like getting out in nature became more important during COVID. And I think that that's what also sparked our initial road trip of like, we got to get to the woods. We're going to spend a month here. We're going to spend a month here. And that's why it's always been nice in the travel that I've been doing the last few years is we were in London before this. And then now we're here in Madaris to balance that city with the city life, with the nature. And so I think that that kind of, I feel like humans need both.
- Speaker #1
things it's like you can't just be in pavement juggles like you have to have like the nature to kind of make yourself not go insane okay so for you after well not after yeah during during after covid when it started to settle down a little bit and travel was possible after the few lockdowns what was your journey next and so were you thinking I need to get more work just to get into this freelance world or were you thinking straight away do you know what I need to go somewhere different and be based there like what were you thinking at that point yeah it was kind of
- Speaker #0
everything at once. I was running a scripted podcast company. So I was producing three scripted podcasts while traveling the world, while growing my freelancing career and continuing to plan more travel indefinitely. And so it just kind of became this thing where it was like more of everything. And that was like a little chaotic in the beginning, but it ended up working out really well. And the freelancing career just completely took off and ended up being like all encompassing. I did so much, so many different... books for book projects for different people because my main focus is memoir ghostwriting and book ghostwriting and editing and so that just kind of completely took over and there just happened to be weeks like that just like all of a sudden like three books land I'm like all right next year like this whole rest of this year I'm totally booked okay like this is what I'm focusing on and so it's been really cool to have just like these projects fall out of the sky and like even this week having like a bunch of new clients just jump out of nowhere and so I think that that's the fun of freelancing is just to like Just be like kind of like going about your normal day with your normal workload. And then all of a sudden a bunch of clients land in and change everything. And that's like what I love because I love the work that I do. And I think that there's such a like an opportunity now for self-publishing in a way that there wasn't in the past. Where self-publishing is becoming more of a viable career and business for people, especially through Amazon KDP, where they handle all the shipping for you and all of the returns and customers and taxes. Like all of the calculations that you would have to do on your own shop and, you know, the printing of the books and all of that, they handle all of that for you. And the books look indistinguishable from a traditionally published book. And I think that that is something that is like completely like unforeseen, like a few decades ago. And so we're kind of at this point where anybody who wants to write a book and publish a beautiful book that reaches audiences, that turns into a business and passive income forever, you can do it. And I think that that is something that is like the new gold rush. And a lot of people, it's like kind of going under their radar a little bit because, you know, people, you know, authors nobody has ever heard of are buying entire like homes with money from their Amazon KDP earnings, their book royalties that you've never heard of them. And I think that that's kind of inspiring because there's so many niches of specific readers that are looking for different kinds of things. And I think that there's so much opportunity in the book world. And I've been kind of chasing that for a while. And I've always been a book fan. And I grew up working in my parents'bookstore where they like sold the shipped books online. And like I just love the world of books. And it's just really cool to see it growing in the way that it has recently.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, that's amazing because we're going to come to your book in a second. I'm actually writing my own book at the minute. Some. I'm going to go the self-publishing route because I've done like 150 guests on the podcast, right? So I think that alongside my own travel stories last decade, I think there's a good combination of reaction to the podcast episodes, some quotes, but also my own stories, right? I think it's quite a nice little mix. So I'm in the process of that. But it is daunting because I don't actually think the writing part is hard. It's all the stuff after it, right? So I will go self-publishing route as well, but I know nothing about it. So that's like probably next year's thought process. But it is exciting to write a book though, isn't it? It's one of those things I think alongside being a musician, I think having an album that's kind of, well, back in the old days, it'd be a CD in a shop, not so much these studies, but as an equivalent for an author, I think it's pretty cool to have your book just there in a bookshop where someone could just browse past it, look at it and buy it. That's a pretty cool feeling, surely.
- Speaker #0
Yeah, it's really cool because the before and after of writing the book, any book that you write is just such a stark difference, even in my own book. after I published my first book, Six Figure Freelance Writer, I just had an outpouring of people who were reaching out to me and saying how much my book changed their life and allowed them to start their freelancing business. And I'm still getting people, I think it's been a year and a half since I published it, who are just reaching out and telling me about how much the book has helped them. And I'm just, that's really cool. And then come into my orbit, I've read it to people on my travels who read my book. And then we have... like there's already they already know so much about me and like the things that i've like that i kind of like would want to share with them so that we can then accelerate the conversation where i need to know them and like i feel like having a book is kind of like catching people up on your life and where you what you've learned and what you've done and you can kind of have deeper conversations because of that um and so it's not just like a calling card or a way to grab clients or increase your your business revenue it does all of those things but it's also such a connector to people that you maybe wouldn't have met otherwise And even my fiction book, which just came out two months ago or a month and a half ago now, has been just like attracting a lot of really amazing people into my orbit. And people are coming out of nowhere, never met, being like, I love the book. When is the second one?
- Speaker #1
That's awesome. You can't beat that. It's amazing.
- Speaker #0
Yeah, you can't beat that. And I think that as a writer, like I think that more people should hit publish faster because I think that there is it just attracts you to the reader. The readers that you're meant to write for will be attracted to you sooner. And that's why I think self-publishing is more powerful than traditional publishing, because there's just that huge delay with traditional publishing of it takes two to three years to go through that process. You could sell a book and then it could never get published. It could get killed in the process. And so there's so many different things that just like will keep you from getting to your ideal readers faster. And then you still have to do marketing if you go traditional publishing, because publishers don't market books very well anymore. And they expect you to hire your own publicist out of your advance. And so. I've seen so many horror stories of people who've gone the traditional publishing route that I just feel like so much more empowered as a self-published writer to like see be able to have full control over my books and then also be able to have like the great little dashboard of book sales being like you sold 108 books this month amazing like that's so cool to be able to have that hit of like people are reading your book and supporting you as a writer and I think that that dopamine hit helps the writing process for the next book and so once you start publishing it becomes addictive so I'm really excited for that.
- Speaker #1
Yeah I think the idea that if you go self-publishing route and you obviously do the costs up front because obviously you're going self-publishing route it's nice to know that at least every book that comes in afterwards is yours in terms of the whether the money is or the sale number right you're not kind of tied to an advance or at least trying to hit some figures that they want you to hear. I guess that leaves the pressure a little bit because if you publish through traditional ways you I guess they would have targets. I guess they take a cut obviously of your sales because they need to recoup the advance. It sounds a really difficult process from a traditional point of view. So the self-publishing point of view, if it's getting easier, that's a result. That means more books are going to come out. It's exciting times if you've got an idea of a book. you can just get right in it and just like you say hit publish i think you're right about that same podcasting publishing even music you can always refine it you can always change it you don't have to come to a point where you need to let perfection go out the window and just get it out there right i think there's a beauty in that because it won't be totally perfect and it'd be like little nuances that maybe people like do you think oh do you know what that wasn't meant to be in there but hey people love it yeah
- Speaker #0
i think a great example of this is i've been reading like more in like the romanticist genre because that's like the big genre that's huge right now And I read this book called Quicksilver earlier this week. I fell in love with it despite it being riddled with typos, riddled with errors. And it's got like over like 200,000 reviews on Amazon and people are loving it and obsessed over it. It's like this whole moment and like the author is just blowing up because the story is that good. So I think that reading that book, I was just like, and I know it's going to get like revised and there will be a new edition to it. It's going to get, you know, updated at some point. But I think that that's kind of like the exciting thing is like she published that book a few months ago and it just completely destroyed the Internet and that corner of that genre. And I think that like if you find your audience, no matter what genre you're in, people will obsess over it and your imperfections won't deter them from reading and sharing your book. And so it's just about it's all about the story. And I think that that's something that I think is really key. Obviously, you don't want any typos, but.
- Speaker #1
you can always the nice thing about self-publishing you can always just upload a new file where you get rid of a typo yeah yeah i think the problem i have is i'm not very good at english so i would have typos grammar errors so i use something like grammarly but the problem with that is you can also choose your options right about what's supposed to be casual or informative you can choose what's supposed to be but then it does end up correcting a lot of stuff that you might just say normally in real life so that it kind of takes away the nuance of you so it's a real hard one because i'm like oh maybe it's write grammatically but is it right from what I'm trying to say in the way I'm trying to say it it's a quite difficult one to get around but I think I have to go grammarly because I don't trust myself to not have typos or bad English definitely yeah when you come into the freelance world so you left your traditional career and stuff and you're going freelance did it take a while to work out how much time you actually have for projects so what I mean by this is you could get like three or four book offers in this week or whatever but how did you know how long like a book offer would take or go around a book or any other services like how long did it take for you to figure that out because obviously if you say yes to everything you're not gonna have time for everything so how did you figure that out yeah
- Speaker #0
I think it's for the nice thing for the first few years my career is I was almost exclusively doing a lot of hourly assignments so even a lot of full book projects I just did hourly because I'm like I have no idea how long this is going to take actually some of the very like research intensive books you Now I know exactly how long a book is going to take. So I can quote a fixed rate. But when I was kind of getting started with some of the earlier books, like, I will only I know I'm going to underbill if I if I try to like put throw out a number. And so I think that I have a lot of calculators on my website and in my book, my book, Fixed Rate Your Freelance Writer about how to break down, okay, how many hours is your ideal work week? And then what is your hourly rate? And then what are the expenses that you're going to have to pay in your business? Now, here's the math equation to make it all work. And here's what you quote your clients. And so I think you do have to start with some pen and paper math of like understanding what your hourly rate needs to be. And even if you're setting a fixed rate, it's like you have to then figure out like how long do you think that product is going to take? And if you add like a 30% cushion on top of what you're going to quote your client so that if it takes longer, you're not working overtime. And there's not always going to be those random projects that end up being more time intensive than others. And some also can take less time. But I think that when it comes to finding that holistic work-life balance and not burning out and having time for your creative projects, it is a little bit trial and error. And it's also about, you know, in the beginning of your freelancing career, you're just having to put in an amount of effort to get anywhere. And then once you have like the flywheel going of clients finding you and returning clients and all this stuff coming into you, then you don't have to go out and... find clients you don't have to pitch you don't have to do any of that so suddenly all of that time is freed up and so i think that i always tell the the freelancers that i that i coach and i help with their their freelancing career in the beginning it's like it's gonna suck in the beginning like you're gonna have to do like a mountain of work in the beginning but you're setting yourself up for success in the long run where then as as you continue to grow like the seo of your website and and find different passive ways to generate leads for clients finding you then once that work is done then a 20-hour work week 30-hour work week like that can kind of be more of what your your your target can be so that the extra hours can be just for for free for free creative work yeah i guess when it gets towards like the middle part where you've done a few years i guess you then start thinking well I do want to travel a little bit, or I do want to be a digital nomad. I want to go and live somewhere for a bit, but not totally work four hours. So I guess then you start thinking, well, how many hours do I want to chop off? And I guess that relates to how many projects you can take on, but also what you charge, right? Because if you charge more, I guess you work less. I guess that's a classic math equation. It's quite an exciting journey if you're up for it, isn't it? I think if you get projects coming in and you're busy with offers and you can even say no to stuff, that's a pretty good place to be.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, no. And it's been really amazing. And I've, even when I was in Hollywood, and I was like, just starting to build my freelancing career, I was always like evangelizing about it to other people. I'm just like, guys, like, we don't have to work for minimal wage. There's actually people on the internet that like value our skillset. I mean, this is crazy. And so I think that like freelancing is kind of the great equalizer. If you have interesting skills, whether it's writing or creating or whatever, there's people that want to hire you and work with you. And I think that the polymaths that have like a bunch of interesting skills and the creative people are going to have the biggest edge in this like AI saturated world where in order to stand out, be above the machine, then you have to have that creative flair to you. So I think that the people who are best positioned in this kind of new economy that's emerging are the flexible freelancers and creatives and people kind of like building things and finding value that they can address. And it kind of requires a little bit of that entrepreneurship mindset, which is why I kind of try to bring a lot of what I learned on the business side into my first book because I was like, they don't teach me. They didn't teach me this. And this was holding me back. I had all of the skills, but I didn't have how to negotiate with a client or set a boundary or raise my rates or how to calculate the math of how to make this lifestyle work in a holistic way. Because I think the business side is often what us creatives are kind of like lacking. But once you put both of those halves together, it's just like the floodgates open and suddenly life is great. And so that's kind of like... what I try to help people cross is that that path where both of those things come together because it's just completely changed my own life.
- Speaker #0
Hey, yeah, just a quick one. I just want to say there are many ways to support this podcast. You can buy me a coffee and help support the podcast with five dollars. Or you can go to my merch store with the affiliate link with TeePublic, where there's plenty of merch available to buy, such as T-shirts, jumpers, hoodies, and also some children's clothing. Thirdly, which is free, you can also rate and Reviewed as Podcasts on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Podchaser or Goodpods. Also, you can find me on social media on Instagram, Twitter, Facebook and TikTok. Simply just search for Winging It Travel Podcast and you'll find me displaying all my social media content for travelling, podcasts and other stuff. Thank you. Okay, and that brings us nicely on to the books. I actually want to touch on your first book that you mentioned there. Can you tell the listeners and the viewers? what the book is titled and also what is the premise of the book?
- Speaker #1
Yeah, so my first book is Six Figure Freelancer, a holistic guide to finding freedom in freelancing. And that is my nonfiction book that is basically a how to build your six figure freelancing career and also a bunch of stories that I've like my own travels and how like they relate. to how I was trying to build different clients and my failures and the lessons that I learned and like the business sense that I learned. So it's partially kind of like a little bit of like a personal essay memoir because I think that the stories that I included really illustrate some of the hangups and the stumbling blocks that a lot of us creatives have of not having the confidence or not being able to pitch ourselves and the things that I dealt with building my freelancing career. So that's the first book that I put out. And then the second one is called The Nomad Detective Volume One. And that is a fiction debut about a traveling nomad, a detective private eye inspired by my travels as a digital nomad.
- Speaker #0
Talk to us more about the fictional book. Do you want to hear like a sort of shocking but random fact? I don't really read fiction that much.
- Speaker #1
Oh,
- Speaker #0
wow. I only read nonfiction, yeah.
- Speaker #1
You're a creative person. You're a musician. You're an artist.
- Speaker #0
I know. And do you know what it relates to? This is interesting. When I was at music college, I was there for four years. And you get your classes, right? You get your sight reading, you read the music, the performances. The one I didn't like the most, and it kind of makes sense, is improvisation. I'm like, I don't want to improvise. I just want to know what I'm playing, which kind of relates to fiction, nonfiction. I guess what I like is real stories, I guess. And I know it's based on the true story, even though that's quite a loose phrase. But fiction, I've read a few fiction books, but I'm trying to get better at it because I don't do well with fictions. Can you tell the listeners what is the backstory and what can you expect from the book?
- Speaker #1
Yeah, so... basically I came up with this idea in a bar in Buenos Aires and at like 2am like that was kind of like the seed so the night out that was 2am yeah the very start of the night if anyone's been to Argentina like you know um and so I was basically sitting around with a bunch of friends who are also digital nomads and we were all talking about our time in Argentina and somebody's like you heard about this like crazy like new drug that people are using to like knock out travelers and steal all their stuff and like And so we started talking about all these crazy crime stories, like below the level of like what we normally talk about. Like usually Digital Noma is talking about like our favorite places that we've gone. And like, and then you see like the Instagrams of all of these, like, you know, Machu Picchu and like Costa Rica. And then we don't talk about like the people getting robbed and like, like all the people are going missing and like all this crazy stuff that I am fascinated by because I always love to think about the worst case scenario. And and I was just like, this is really interesting. And so I wanted to kind of like take this idea of like, what if there was somebody who helps these people who, you know, are expats or travelers who have gone missing or things have gone terribly wrong? Like who helps these people? Because obviously the local police are not going to do anything about most of these things. And so there's always kind of been these like in these missing persons cases to be like this third party brought in. And so that kind of kind of brought to me this idea of this new version of Sherlock. Holmes, this private eye, nomad detective who's traveling the world first. Her main goal is to find her missing sister who's gone missing in Guatemala. But as she's doing so, she's trying to collect clues by helping other people and solving their cases. And so she's kind of embarking on this journey. And she's also aided by this ability that she has to see auras and to kind of sense people and who's lying to her. And so she has a little bit of like some extra skills, just like how Sherlock has his sense of deduction. she has this ability to kind of sense what people's auras are and she has synesthesia so our senses get a little mixed up and so it's really interesting to kind of like play with this length of a character who has like an ability to kind of like parse through the what people are saying to her what's true and to kind of like figure out who she's dealing with as he's traveling the world and running into these people that are either running towards something or running away from something and are not what they seem and everything is kind of loosely inspired by my own travels throughout the world and all of the things that have happened kind of on like one layer below in the underground of travel of like where things have gone wrong yeah you do hear those stories i don't know when you travel when you're like hanging out at a hostel and you
- Speaker #0
just hear so many stories i do remember one in india where there's like 10 of us are sitting there recording stories maybe people who just started traveling can believe some of the stories that you hear and uh i do wonder like with your book have you
- Speaker #1
kind of disguised a bit is there some stories that you maybe experienced or just heard through other travelers it couldn't blend it's it's it's kind of a blend of different things like when we were doing the Inca Trail the 26 mile hike to Machu Picchu in Peru um I heard there's some incredible stories that were kind of myths and legends about like ghost stories on the trail and how there were and I just loved those I was like oh this is really interesting and so I tried to kind of pull as much as I could from local lore or like things that were happening that that kind of like that were like through the grapevine rumors and things like that and a lot more were a lot of the book is obviously fictionalized but i tried to kind of figure out how to pull from real stories to like give it that that feeling like grounded in truth of like you know when you're in peru you have a tour guide who's like pointing at these giant boulders in the middle of cusco and being like we have no idea how these stones got there they're too heavy for humans to carry so it's probably aliens that once one historian says assumed and i'm like i love that I love this idea of like these real life mysteries kind of creating a backdrop for a mystery that that my main character deals with on the Inca Trail. And I was like, this would be a perfect place for a murder. And so I think that this is kind of like the fascinating kind of element of it is taking my real life experiences in these places and then fictionalizing events based on local legends, on true crime stories and kind of putting everything in a soup and making a plate from it.
- Speaker #0
Yeah, I was then thinking that's a good idea for even for a podcast, right? if you get like, does travellers come on about stories they've ever experienced or heard, that'd be quite an interesting podcast because I think so many people, if you travel for a while or like for a longer period of time, I think you can hear some stuff and even see some stuff as well. I just remember like the first thing I said about Inca Trail, I was like, oh, what comes to mind for me? Of course, I've done the four day hike. It's great. It's hard work, bloody hard work. You get there, it's amazing, perfect morning. But the one thing that sticks out is a bit of a shame really, apart from seeing it. Machu Picchu there in clear blue sky no one there when the tourists start to come from Aguas Calientes they come up in the buses we just done our morning there so we kind of like we're on the way back to Aguas Calientes to go and chill out because we've been walking for four days I just remember like some people just laughing at us like as we're coming down because we're like we're all sweating we're all tired we've all got our gear we're all kind of like walking in line as if you were as if you're hiking up they're like oh it looks like they've been led away to prison I think that's what someone said like there's American tourists I'm like That's the only thing I remember, apart from obviously the best bit of Machu Picchu. I don't really recall much of the trek apart from day two past Dead Woman's Pass. But other than that, I just remember looking at him going, oh, mate, we just walked for four days. Legs are tired. We can barely walk now. These give us a bit of credit. But yeah, that's just what I remember. Not really like a juicy story, but like just some things that stick in your mind, isn't it?
- Speaker #1
I think it's such a badge of honor, though, because I've read a lot of and I've heard a lot of stories from people. If you just went to Machu Picchu with the buses, a lot of people are like, Machu Picchu, it's fine. But then if you hike to the Fort Inca Trail and you sweat and like you pass the wild alpacas, they might like run you over and you're like, what's going on here? And you finally cross through the sun gate and as the sun is rising, you see Machu Picchu. The relief of not only, thank God, I'm done with hiking, but also. This is what I've been hiking for and I've been following this ancient path. Like, I think that that's really special. And that's why I put one of the stories in the book, why that is like one of the major set pieces of crossing through the Sun Gate and then things are happening. Because I think that that's just such an epic, dramatic moment. And that when you do that, that you can't experience and you're just busted and you're like, oh, Machu Picchu. Like, you don't get the relief. You don't earn it in the way that I think that if you do the Porte Inca Trail or the Saucontay Track. then you really earn like that view and that entry point into Machu Picchu.
- Speaker #0
Yes, earning it isn't it. I got a selfie with a llama as well, or alpaca. Oh yeah, yeah. It just came up to me. You do think they're gonna walk over you. I just gave it an Oreo because I had a pack of Oreos. And I just snapped at the right time where his or her left eye looked at the camera. So I got this selfie with this alpaca at Machu Picchu. Like, that can't be beaten for me. I'm like, how are you gonna get that in the future? Even people who do Machu Picchu don't get that. So I do have that as a pro-go-to occasionally. It's quite a funny one. Yeah.
- Speaker #1
yeah that's cool um are you more comfortable writing non-fiction or fiction both i think fiction was something i had to kind of dust off a little bit i grew up writing novels for national novel writing months the 30-day challenge where you write a novel in a month just for fun so i did that for six years straight high school into college and i just love the process of novel writing because i think it definitely kind of like takes something out of your brain like allows you to to like process something and so i think that like novel writing is really special and then Non-fiction writing I like because I feel like it's very like it's a way to help people. Yeah. And I really love that ability to just like help others through sharing knowledge. And it's something that I'm passionate about that I do on my blog and on my sub stack. And so I have a lot of methods to try to help people learn the things that I wish somebody told me. And I feel like non-fiction is that attempt to like exercise that feeling of like, oh, I wish someone told me that. So if I wasn't told this, then other people would benefit from it.
- Speaker #0
And how does your blogging help you as well in terms of writing a book? Or is it completely different?
- Speaker #1
Yeah. So I started my blog when I was like 12. And it's been like one of the main drivers of being able to like basically have clients find me and different opportunities find me. And then most recently, I started my Substack hate newsletter, which is basically the way that I share more knowledge. And I have like a paywall for posts. But in terms of the Substack, like I think Substack is really interesting. Have you heard of the platform or are you familiar?
- Speaker #0
Oh, yeah. I'm technically on it. I just say. I gave up my newsletter because no one really signed up. I've got like 22 or 23 subscribers, right? I started using it because I found MailChimp not that good, a bit clunky, just didn't like it. So I know a few podcasters who use Substack, so I thought I'll start it. There's probably a project for me in the new year when I've got a few things out of the way this year, including travels. I think I will get that going again. It's just a bit of an art to write a good newsletter, I think.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, but I think that once you kind of like capture, I think that the newsletter is like really interesting. format for your audience because I think everybody checks their email and because that's where a lot of important things come in whereas I have been on platforms with social media where I like grown a platform and then all of a sudden the views start changing because the algorithm has changed and suddenly the 47,000 followers I've cultivated on TikTok are not seeing my posts and so having an email newsletter for creators of any kind I think is really helpful because nicely about Substack is you can download all your subscribers and like leave if you don't like the platform. Or like on TikTok, there's no way for me to reach all of my subscribers. And so I think that there is kind of like owning your own audience as like a writer or creator is really important. Because if you put too much effort into a platform that then either bans you or deletes your account or just deprioritizes your content, then you kind of lose that ability to communicate with your community.
- Speaker #0
It's a great point because the other day, Instagram banned me for a day. I had no idea why. I just got the message saying, can't access your account. You're not following the guidelines. you have 90 days to appeal if you don't appeal it's going i'm like what what's happened here so i peeled it and i got you know got reinstated but no idea why and the shock i actually thought if that happens i don't care but actually when it happened like oh shit like i actually can't communicate my podcast episodes anymore so that kind of got me thinking i need an alternative i do have my website which is fine but unless you go there and maybe look at the show notes of the podcast or the youtube i have maybe you might go there but you're right i think the newsletter is a is a backup, but also a great way to communicate with your audience. And I think I will get that started again. And I feel like Substack. has so many things available to you. I feel that's a bit of a thing to learn. There's newsletters, I get it. You can do posts, you can do, I think polls, I think obviously paid stuff as well. There's a lot of options on Substack, looks like quite a good platform to use.
- Speaker #1
Yeah. And I think it's what's nice is like, it's free podcast hosting, free email hosting, like everything is free. And then, then Substack also brings you an audience, which I think is really great. And their discovery tools are amazing. So that's why I think it's something that every creator should be prioritizing because it's just like, It's got so many things built in for so many creators. And I've seen just like a huge increase in my subscribers from joining Substack. And I think that I think it should be like the core. And I also think that a lot of people don't recognize how many people in their audience want to pay and support them. And getting like that notification of like a new paid subscriber is just like makes me so giddy, even though it's like a very small piece of like my income. Like it's such a cool thing to be like, oh, my gosh, this person is finding value from the things I'm sharing. Like, that's so cool. And it's just. like also brought a lot of awareness to the different services that I offer and the different things that I do and my book sales have like definitely grown because of it. And so I think a lot of people don't recognize like how once you have an email newsletter base, like it just like will help you with everything. And the nice thing about platforms like Substack and also Beehive is that they post your newsletters to a website for you that's part of your platform so that you can also get the Google traffic. You're getting traffic from Substack, traffic from Google, and your newsletter can be revisited and reread rather than like a ConvertKit or maybe not ConvertKit, but like some other platforms that just send the newsletter. And then once they're in the ether, they're gone. And I think that this is kind of like a great way for creators that have evergreen content like podcasts to really retain that audience and give them a lot of value.
- Speaker #0
Yeah, because I do write a blog for each episode. So maybe that should also be a newsletter, 100%, or at least part of it. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, 100%. I think Patreon is another one as well for podcasters that is good to use because you can offer exclusive content. It's another way of doing things as well. Yeah, these are things I've kind of thought about, started, didn't go well, left, come back to. So it's on my radar. But it's another thing to do, isn't it? Amongst all the other things. It's quite hard if you're on your own like I am. So if I'm trying to do YouTube and a podcast, which is weekly and long format mostly, and travel and try and get content, it's a lot. I need to read your book about how to get the freelancing going and maybe even export some of the jobs or outsource it. Right. So, yes, I'm a radar.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, definitely.
- Speaker #0
I'm going to go to travels for sure. And I've actually got two sets of questions for travels. One set is going to be just travel, personal travel, and one maybe based on the digital nomad mindset. So I'm quite intrigued by that. So for traveling. What type of traveler are you? Are you a backpacker? Are you mid-range? Are you luxury? What's your style?
- Speaker #1
Yeah, I think it's kind of in the in-between where I really like finding cute Airbnbs, but I also like the digital nomad co-living space. And so I've kind of like experimented with some different co-living like digital nomad hotels like Outsite and Selena. And I think that those are fun. But I do think that like my favorite places I've stayed have been Airbnbs because... I think that I travel with my partner, Kyle. So it's nice for us to have like a kitchen and like workspaces. And we both have like Zoom calls. And so it's nice to have like a space of your own. And as an introvert, I really appreciate having like kind of like an apartment away from home. And because I'm a full-time traveler, I don't have an apartment or anything back in the States. And so I'm full-time traveling. So my rent is the Airbnb of the month or wherever we're staying. Yeah. And so I think that that's kind of the better. I think the challenging thing is always like how do you build community as a nomad? And so staying in these like kind of like digital nomad hotels or we travel occasionally with digital nomad groups is helpful. But I do always kind of feel the sense of like, oh, I kind of want a little more personal space. And so having like a one or two bedroom apartment has kind of been the priority. And so traveling through like Airbnbs and we found some like really cute Airbnbs that are like very well priced, like all over the world. And I think that. I think that kind of trying to understand like what place, like where, what, what is like your expensive cities that you're going to be in a year? And then what are the cheaper cities that you're going to be in a year? And kind of combine them so that you can kind of like have like really cool places, but not blow out your budget.
- Speaker #0
Yeah. I'm trying to work that out for my trip in November, right? Cause I'm going to Central America for a month, but I'm traveling solo this time. And accommodation is a big question for me because naturally I'm a, I'm a backpacker and hostel guy, but the thought of doing a four bed dorm where it's like tubicools or even bunk beds, I just. not sure I can do it because I'm also a bit introverted but also have content to crack on with right so I need that that bit of space but then you look at private rooms and in hostels they're not even that cheap anymore so I think ah then you start filtering away from that and going to hotels which aren't that more expensive so like El Salvador for example when I'm looking in san salvador not that much difference between a private hostel and just a budget okayish looking hotel and then you go to airbnb and it's like oh there's better value there but part of me doesn't like airbnb because of some stories i've heard and the way they treat locals but i don't think it's the same for every country so if i could find somewhere that's genuine where it's like the old style airbnb where is someone's house and you are literally live with the host uh that's fine my only worry with airbnb is meeting people i don't know what your experience is of you I know you're traveling with your partner, but do you get to meet many travelers if you're booking like Airbnbs or anywhere that's like siloed, like a hotel room? How does that work? Yeah,
- Speaker #1
that's always a tricky thing. But we've joined a lot of digital nomad groups and that helps us where we're on their Slack. We're like, who's in town? And luckily, we're always somehow overlapping with people. We've made so many digital nomad friends over the past four years that we also kind of like slightly adjust our travels to. be with other nomads. So we were in Edinburgh for the Fringe Festival and a lot of our nomad friends were going to be there. So we did that in part to see them in part to be for the Fringe Festival. And so I think that it's like trying to kind of figure out like, what are the spaces that I want to be in? Um, trying to figure out what types of digital nomad groups you want to join. Um, so I think that that helps a lot, but it is, it can be a little bit more isolating to say an Airbnb or a hotel, but it's just about really spending the time and effort to build that community. Um, I think the community question is always something that my partner and I go back to. We're like, are we are we satisfied with the community we have around us? And it's not we're not we're not quite sure. Like sometimes like we're very satisfied. We're around people we really appreciate. But I think that I think it's always tricky. It's like the balance of that is the hardest thing because you're having these amazing experiences. You're meeting really cool people, but then they're gone after a few days. Yeah. If you're not traveling more with them. And so I think that that's the thing is like the transient nature of this lifestyle is difficult on the community side. And so that's eventually when we do settle down, like the priority will be building a more permanent community. But I think that like some people have really aced it and really know how to build a community when they travel. But I think that I think that's the tricky thing, especially if you're traveling with a partner. And then then it becomes a lot easier to stay in and like hang out with them. And so it's like it removes a little bit of the incentive to meet new people as well. So it's like I think that balance is tricky, especially because I am such an introvert. And it's like it's not. So I think that that's the thing that I haven't. fully figured out as the highest extent that I think that other people have cracked more than I have.
- Speaker #0
Yeah, I think you're absolutely right about that. I think maybe I do counteract with the Airbnb question of maybe doing like a free walk and tour. So I booked two for San Salvador, two in two days. They're going to do roughly the same thing, but you know what, I'm going to meet two locals and maybe three, four, five, 10 other people in each of those groups. The community thing is a problem in terms of when you travel, even normal times, if you're not looking to like be additional nomad, but just travel. two or three four months like southeast asia is a classic example you are going to bump into the same people but they are gone after two three days and you might see them again in two weeks if you're on the same route but like those amazing experiences do last only for two days and they are three days and that's it they're gone like you still you still get my facebook or on instagram but the likelihood of being in touch with them again in the same sort of environment is quite rare
- Speaker #1
Yeah. And I think that that's the tricky thing that everyone's trying to solve in the digital nomad community. Like there's so many groups and apps and environments. I think it's just tricky because it's like people don't invest in things that they don't see as long term. And I think that even though I met so many amazing people on my travels, like I've really connected with a lot of people and stayed in touch with a lot. But I think that it's just the long term like friendships that become deeper are often have to be the ones where you just see them in person more than once every six months. Sure. And so I think that is the thing that is like the, the only downside of the, one of the few downsides of the digital nomad lifestyle, if you're able to build a remote business and travel and not work too much and be able to stay in Airbnbs that you really like. And then like, like that, those pieces can are all very flexible. But I think the thing that I've seen, I've heard from a lot of nomads is that they, once they realize they can't fully get to that like level of community that they want, they usually kind of decide to like get out of the cycle and then have a home base. be where their their community is and i think that there's a lot of different types of nomading from like full-time nomading to just like you have a home base and then you do like workations or you know one or two to three months trips like during the year and so i think that eventually i'll probably move to the model like having a home base and traveling for a few months out of the year i think that's the model we're going to after our year trip eventually
- Speaker #0
because uh you said that you are full-time traveling right in terms of you don't have a base and you're that's the same with us last year we quit everything here left and took everything with us so no base no anywhere so I'm like ah that was great but the thinking that came to my mind is it wasn't actually really based on community is more based on just chilling out because if you do manage to have a base and it's not too much an expense that could be like a small apartment somewhere so you at least can go home and chill out for two months if you've just been traveling for too long or you just need a break to maybe do something creatively or you just want to chill out maybe catch up with old friends whatever it is but obviously we couldn't do that because we're still in the same trap of trying to get an airbnb or or somewhere at home even so i think we've we thought you know what a base is good for long-term travel i think because you can just quit
- Speaker #1
after six months and go do you know what i'm gonna chill out for a summer and then go back to it after that so that option would be pretty cool yeah definitely and so i think that that's the thing that everyone's trying to figure out for themselves like what what does it make sense and so i think that there's sometimes it's also very freeing not to have a home base so i remember i gave up everything and sold my car in los angeles i'm like goodbye yeah it
- Speaker #0
was great it's best feeling in the world that morning when you like cleaned me up yeah yeah i think there's something very when you
- Speaker #1
first become a minimalist because I was very much like a clutter fiend before being able to get rid of everything and like the and I only travel out of a carry-on suitcase so that's that's all my clothes for all four seasons and I think that that's so freeing and so cool to be able to just like become a minimalist and realize you didn't need to spend all the money on all that stuff and I think that that is like that lifestyle shift is huge and so when I eventually get a home base again I'll know how good it feels to be a gnome or be a minimalist and be able to like really kind of like keep my minimalist lifestyle with a base so that I can still travel but not get overwhelmed by having to maintain a bunch of stuff and like like you know be worried about like a car or like things like that and so I think being a minimalist and really kind of reshaping your lifestyle like after travel I think I think that that is like a good superpower to have.
- Speaker #0
Yeah it's pretty freeing um but you're right I've been kind of working out for 12 years so finally took 12 years of doing that you know leaving job quitting everything sending everything it's a journey I think people need to
- Speaker #1
work out what they want and I think it changes over time and with age and who you're with who you're not with but as well I think that changes I think that's a little blessing exactly what you're describing like that ability to like wipe the slate clean and yeah over I know so many people who are stuck in their same lives and they're unhappy in their same lives and I've just been stuck for like 10 years and I think that that is like the trap that a lot of people get stuck in is like oh I have this house and or this apartment and it's like car and a pet and like this is my life and I cannot leave it and this is what I am like Like, even if I'm unhappy, then this is what I'm stuck with. Whereas, like, it's so cool that, like, I'm able to travel and just be like, this place, I'm not going to move here after all. I'm going to keep on traveling. Or, like, I think I'm going to be here. Just kidding. We're going to Portugal. And so I think that that, like, ability to try to have a lot of messy action and try things out, I think is, like, the beauty of travel. Because you can try on identities and places and environments and friends and then decide, wait, yes to that, no to that. And then this is working, but this isn't. I think that that's the true gift. of travel is also understanding yourself in a deeper level.
- Speaker #0
Yeah, slow travel as well, right? Having the ability to make those decisions. Yeah, that's a dream scenario, I think. If you can get your working, making money thing sorted, where it's online, and you then have the ability to choose where to go, I don't see a better lifestyle than that. And my rule, even though I'm a bit more settled for this year here, is can I just quit tomorrow? And if you get into that position where it's a yes, I think that's a good place to be. If you're no and it's based on a huge mortgage or just expenses or debt or whatever it is, that's a problem because you are trapped. And if you're a big traveler, but you're trapped, that sounds like COVID to me where you can go travel because of one thing or another. People need to be aware of that. If they're looking to maybe escape, they need to give themselves the ability to escape. Otherwise, it's quite difficult. You're right. People spend 10 years thinking about it and that decade goes, right? Crazy. Yeah. Okay.
- Speaker #1
travel three places that you traveled to personally um where you thought you know what these places are amazing probably my favorite places or you've even gone back to because you loved it the first time yeah uh the first one immediately comes to mind obviously Peru I think everyone should do the Inca Trail Machu Picchu I think it's a just a life-affirming experience and also the produce and the avocados in Peru it's insane like we took a cooking class where we ate like this exotic fruit that tasted like like a like vanilla custard it was amazing so the food in kuzco was so good so definitely think that and then secondly istanbul turkey i went for the first time this year gorgeous gorgeous city just on this beautiful stretch of water and the food is amazing turkish breakfast i ate turkish breakfast like so many times during my month there yeah just you're you're when it's possible for breakfast just like the rest of europe can learn so much from istanbul i think we need to like We need to, we need to like up our game. Like everybody needs to understand what turkey breakfast brings to the table. Delicious.
- Speaker #0
And then I think third, Buenos Aires, Argentina, such an underrated city. Just so cool. A lot of good salsa dancing. We went to a tango show. That was amazing. But I think that there's just like such a beautiful like architecture and the coffee shops are amazing. Even though I don't drink coffee anymore, like I love cafe culture. And I think that like that city just has like kind of this European. flair but like filled with like this like latin american charm and it's just like a very very interesting unique place and i just had an amazing time and everybody was so friendly there even though the mosquitoes were crazy the food was amazing and it made it worth it and so i think argentina as a whole should be on everybody's list oh yeah buenos aires was just amazing yeah it's interesting to say cusco and the first answer because if i was to i'm coming to this for you in a minute to
- Speaker #1
think of two like two or three areas in the world that i just want to try out as a digital nomad because i've been there before as a traveler Cusco is one of those I love the city and maybe because I just felt like a sense of achievement after doing Inca Trail and I was chilling out for a bit just checking out the city wandering around the cold streets I just loved it just loved the vibe maybe that's like a post-hike achievement high if you like but I need to go back and see it in the normal time of not doing Inca Trail and just kind of confirm what I thought but I love the city yeah cool what about three places that your favorite for digital nomadings I guess This might change a little bit because you've got to think of maybe lifestyle, internet, even food comes into that as well, and maybe cost as well. So where are you thinking for that?
- Speaker #0
Yeah, I know in Athens, Greece was actually amazing with fast internet, some pretty affordable Airbnbs in certain parts of the city. You have to be a little careful with what neighborhoods you pick, but I think that the food was just exceptional. I think a lot of tourists skip Athens or just use it as a jumping off point for the islands. you're close to just some really beautiful places and the food was amazing i think athens is like just a really great place and the locals that we met were really friendly and cool um and then i would still say istanbul i think that i think if we stayed in this really great neighborhood uh it was like the beglu neighborhood and it was kind of like the the neighborhood where all of like the models were shuttled to like go hang out in between photo shoots but it was also just like a very hip cool neighborhood with so many just kind of like interesting like little like like food spots and like little like there's a ton of barbers like hairstylists in that little neighborhood it was just like this weird hipster kind of area that was really really cool so i think the banglu neighborhood of istanbul it's like a little bit more pricey than other parts of turkey but um i think it's worth it for like how cool like walking distance you are to so many different things in that area and then i think the third place would probably this is kind of like this is hard there's so many really cool places i feel like Lisbon is great. Like I think Lisbon is a little bit oversaturated now. I haven't been in a few years, but when I went, I just loved how temperate it was, how being like right next to the ocean just like was really beautiful. And the architecture and the city is just so charming, so beautiful. I have a lot of friends who just ended up getting the digital Nomad visa and staying there. They love it so much. And so I think that Lisbon just has a charm, even though I know it's completely overrun with nomads in a way these days, but. I think that it is for a reason and to be so close to the ocean and to be just like in such a beautiful city and the pasta donatas, the custard tarts are just so good. I was obsessed. It was amazing. Oh,
- Speaker #1
they're three great things. Yeah. In Istanbul, my partner has someone who's from Turkey, from Istanbul, and she told us to go to an area called Moda. Has a nice little walk along the water, trendy cafes. One of the best breakfasts I've had on our traveling last year. Just an unreal little area. Bit weird in terms of weather. It was a bit foggy that day, but once it cleared up, the view is incredible over the water. So that was the area that we went to called Moda. I think it's a pretty hip, trendy area as well, a bit like yours. What a place Istanbul is. That's a crazy place. That has everything. If you want chill or crazy or both in the same day, you can find it.
- Speaker #0
Yeah, it's cool.
- Speaker #1
Have you ever experienced culture shock?
- Speaker #0
Yeah, I think probably Tokyo and Kyoto. My first time in Japan. I think when I just... I was traveling with a group of nomads and like as part of our like first two days there, one of the nomads we were traveling with gave us like a rundown on like the culture and the etiquette and the rules of what you were allowed to do and not allowed to do. And I just felt, I felt like, oh man, there's so many rules. You could bring socks with you just in case they make you take off your shoes and at dinner, but then you don't want like bare feet on things. And so you have to be quiet on the buses, like no talking on public transportation. You're not allowed to drink. coffee or tea and walk at the same time you can't eat food and watch and it was just so many rules and so I was just like completely like my first few days there I'm like I don't know if I'm gonna like Japan I don't know if this is a place for me I like rules but maybe not this much and everyone's very quiet and very polite like I don't know how to feel about this But then I ended up joining a yoga studio for the month that I was there and Kyoto. And I just had a really great time. I got to know one of my instructors who was really amazing. And like she kind of told me about like her upbringing there and like about like what she like, like her journey as like a yoga instructor. And like I just really bonded with her and some other locals and people that were very friendly. And so I think that like even though the rules based coach culture was very upsetting at first, I understand why. And like the reverence that they have for, you know, keeping their city clean. quiet and nice and it's just such a peaceful city and I would just like go to my yoga class and then work at Blue Bottle for the day and then walk back through the Imperial Gardens and it was just this like beautiful peaceful routine in in the city and so even though I was cultured back a little high I I got over it and like followed all the rules and it felt like the city was very very peaceful and nice because of it even though I wouldn't spend too much time here I think that I really enjoyed it for for what it was okay yeah Japan
- Speaker #1
amazing country but i think you know weirdly we had i thought i had culture shock at the end of my trip in japan after a month we finished in osaka and i was like what is this place there is transport on the same level above me and beneath me it's all intertwining i'm like i've just had japan for a month i think i thought i was used to but osaka for me was a different level so couldn't get my head around it yeah really weird you think you'd be at the start of a trip wouldn't you but i found tokyo like a bit okay for that i thought oh do you know what
- Speaker #0
it's a k start it's not too bad but osaka at the end i need to go back actually and just yeah kind of yeah see what i think now also kind of like feels like the venice beach of japan like it's very weird like very like like like i'm not sure if you spend any time in venice beach in los angeles oh yeah yeah yeah trendy it's like we i remember walking down a street in in osaka and seeing a man in a um a spider-man costume dancing to a violinist who was playing on the street I was like, where are we? We left Japan. I don't know what's going on here. So it was a very strange place in the heart of Osaka. But yeah, the transportation is insane and sometimes a maze to navigate. Even in Tokyo, I got to a point where I was in this train station, but I couldn't tap out because I had gone the wrong way. So I was trapped inside and I had to get someone to help me. And I was like, I can't leave. It won't let me pay to leave this thing. It's a little overwhelming.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I hear you. Has there been a place either traveling or as Digital Nomad where you didn't like and actually left earlier or couldn't wait to get out of?
- Speaker #0
Yes, the Amalfi Coast. It's cursed. Nobody should go to the Amalfi Coast. Oh, wow. We arrived. This is also right in 2021. So COVID wasn't fully over and the Amalfi Coast had gotten really hit by it. And so we were immediately like price gouged by the taxi driver who like doubled how much we were. being charged like the the restaurants were way like clearly had like doubled their prices like it was just like and it's also like we were staying like like on hills to get to the beach we had to go down like 400 flights of stairs yeah and so to go back up it was awful and so it's like we didn't like the food it was like everybody there was like it was very touristy like it was not like i think if you're gonna do the malpico's like do two or three days in like the major resort and then get out like but i i thought that it was Out of all the beach towns that I stayed in, that was one of my least favorites. That one in Santa Teresa, Costa Rica, which is awful. I think another like completely turned into like a like a very touristy place where the locals have been exploited and they take that up to tourists. And like it's just not it's just not a good vibe and way too expensive to be like drinking an $18 smoothie on a dirt road. Like that's that's not that's not what we're here for. So I think. Yeah. And so it's like, if you're going to pay California prices, you should be in California. Yeah. And so I think that those two places, I feel like beaches are really hard to find good cities on. And that's why Madera has been so amazing because it doesn't feel like tourists have descended on this place. Like, even though it is pretty touristy, like, it's very peaceful and it feels like a lot of locals are still here and it feels like more relaxing and peaceful. And I don't feel like that, you know, it's confirmed into like a Disneyland like some of the other other. beach cities.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, I think for Madeira, I think if you're willing to drive, there's loads of little pockets away from Funchal where I just don't think you'll see many tourists. I can't really remember in our little area, I know we walked down, it wasn't really a beach, but there was like a, so Madeira's got a lot of roundabouts and then like, as you know, loads of tunnels and roundabouts, like just the one village over where the shop was and a little gathering area of a beach, wasn't that busy? That's fine. All locals, pretty much. A few tourists. So I think if you're willing to drive a Madeira. you can definitely find your little pocket of, I guess, traditional Madeiran life. But yeah, you're right. Trying to find beach towns in Europe. Yeah, it's tough. I think they're kind of all been talked about.
- Speaker #0
uh holidayed written about yeah i think it's hard to find those little gems i suppose isn't it yeah definitely and i think that like as nomads like especially if you're not traveling for vacation or if you're traveling for longer periods of time the the places that people go on holiday kind of like have a little bit less of an appeal because i feel like i'm always trying to find a place that i can be based in for a month and and spend a good amount of time in and so The problem with beach towns is like people are just going for vacation. So there isn't really like a way to like live there for any longer than a few days and feel like it's a good time. And so I think that's also the difference of the type of traveler you are. It's like if you're just going for vacation, then you might really love the Amalfi Coast because you're in and out for a few days and you don't care how much money you're spending on like overpriced food because you've got the beach and the ocean and things like that. But I think that if you're a nomad, it's like you're going for like cultural experiences and to be immersed in a place and to understand like.
- Speaker #1
history of it and like and you want something more than just like margaritas on a beach yeah yeah absolutely that's why i chose kapathos island in greece as my as my island to go to i think that's a bit of a gem in between roads and creek you get the most tourists i guess um but in between there's an island that no one really goes to and uh yeah i met a couple of like digital nomads on there which i think they're one of the only very few who live there full time i think there's like a couple and uh Yeah, they bought a house really cheap and it's right by the airport and by the beach. I'm like, oh.
- Speaker #0
Oh, wow. Nice.
- Speaker #1
Kapothos Island, if you're looking for a non-busy Greek island. Okay. Key tips maybe for someone who's looking to transition into being a digital nomad from like traditional life.
- Speaker #0
Yeah. I think the number one thing that everybody should do is become a minimalist.
- Speaker #1
Okay. Yeah. Agreed.
- Speaker #0
Because I started the digital nomad life with a check bag and that was the biggest mistake ever. Okay. And I think that anybody who thinks that they need a check bag. bag even if you're going to be in a place for a month you are going to like regret being to lug that check bag through the airport if your flight gets delayed like it's not worth it you start to dread travel days and so very early on in my digital nomad journey i'm like okay this is it i'm downsizing there's too many stairs in the world to have a check bag and so getting to a roller bag and a backpack i think is kind of the clutch thing to do especially if your backpack fits on to your little carry-on roller bag you And so you can just wheel them around the airport and not worry about putting your backpack on like the gross airport floor. I think that that's like the perfect combo. I know that some people do backpacks, but I think that the roller bag is kind of nicer, a little more hygienic and easier to kind of like lug around. It's a little more annoying on cobblestones, but I think, you know, it's fine. I think the tradeoffs are worth it because you spend more time like in the airport. And so I think that what getting down to that. and then still reserving space in your bag because I you still realize like oh I actually need an extra pair of pants or I need this and so you end up having to buy things anyway so it's like you almost have to be more of a minimalist so not only just fitting into a carry-on suitcase but fitting onto a carry-on suitcase with like a third space for your trip so that you can have some time to like buy some small things or buy a like a wardrobe item and I think that being a minimalist is like then suddenly frees up so much more space creatively, work-wise, productivity-wise. It just makes you feel better. And I have been a maximalist for all of my life. And I feel like the moment I became a minimalist, I saved so much money, my life changed, like, and then being able to like travel later just is like a psychologically different feeling. And it also makes the ability to just go and jump on a plane feel a lot easier.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, agreed. Minimalist is key. I don't think I could ever be not that anymore. I think once you transition to that. It's hard to see the need to clog up a load of stuff. The only stuff you could really clog up in my mind is books. I don't know what you feel about that. You can't be a good book in there physically when you buy the book. So that's the only thing I can think of where I would clog up on stuff, I think. And maybe like tech for creating podcasts or YouTube stuff.
- Speaker #0
Do you have a Kindle? Do you have like an e-reader?
- Speaker #1
Yeah, I bought one a month ago. Yeah.
- Speaker #0
I think that's clutch. I actually really love the e-reader because it allows you to read in the dark with the backlight and you can highlight things. I just got like the Kindle Unlimited subscription so you can read like limited books. I think that that's kind of like the clutch thing. And I think that a lot of people like I love reading physical books, but I think I've finally gotten to the point where I'm like, OK, the Kindle is just good enough. It's perfect. It's like all I need. I can buy books later. And I get it's also more cost effective with like the Kindle Unlimited and like the cheaper e-books. And so it's like it is better overall. And it's like it's more of a minimalist move that I think is I think it's just better.
- Speaker #1
I'm glad to hear that. because I was a bit cringed about it like oh I'm not buying books anymore but for traveling it's light easy to pack and it lasts ages if you're gonna charge it up so I think it's a perfect companion for traveling if you're looking to read so yeah I'm really excited about it want to hear about maybe like where people can find you like websites social medias but also what services you can offer in terms of freelancing or releasing books and stuff like that
- Speaker #0
Definitely. So everyone can find me at my website, amysuto.com and on my social media at pseudoscience, my last name, S-U-T-O science. And so that basically the services that I offer is memoir ghostwriting, as well as help with certain people's projects for book editing and book publishing. I'm a little pickier on which products I take on for book publishing and book editing and book marketing because I work with a book. I collaborate with a book marketing team that helps, but I only want to work with certain types of projects. But I'm always happy to hear what people are working on to see if it's something that falls under my wheelhouse that I can help them with. And then for book ghostwriting, I usually help entrepreneurs. I do mostly nonfiction, but I occasionally started to take on some fiction projects. And that's been really fun so far, too. And then on the coaching side, I also offer coaching packages for people who want to get into freelancing or people who want to grow their sub stack. And yeah, so those are the kind of the things that I do and help people with. And then I have a ton of free resources on my website, amysudo.com. And then my Substack from the desk of amysudo.substack.com.
- Speaker #1
Awesome. Okay. I'll put links all in the show notes there. Your last name is Suto. Where's that from?
- Speaker #0
Who knows? I'm from Polish. I like, there's like, we have, my heritage is a mystery. One of many things I'm trying to get, though. But we're not really sure what happened on Ellis Island to get our last name shortened to. It's probably like pseudo-Whiskey or something. And I'm like, nope, can't spell that. So, can't do that. But no, I'm not like, I don't have an exotic background. I'm just a Polish immigrant.
- Speaker #1
Okay. And I've got to finish the episode before we go to the quickfire travel questions. Where have you been featured? Because I know on your website, if people go on there, they're going to see where you've been featured. That's quite impressive. Can you tell the listeners and viewers where you've been featured before?
- Speaker #0
Yeah, I've gotten bylines in publications like the LA Times. My work has been featured in... BBC Worldwide Business Report I was interviewed and then Parade Magazine and Forbes and a whole bunch of other places so yeah quite quite a few and I have a few more bylines coming out this year with some other pieces I've been commissioned to write in for different publicies.
- Speaker #1
Awesome and I've got Substack on here obviously people should sign up to your newsletter right?
- Speaker #0
Yeah you're everyone is welcome to and I share a lot of travel tips on there I have free travel guides on my website amysudo.com and so If you want to stay in the loop of travel destinations and tips on how to make writing your job and things like that, my Substack website has all the links.
- Speaker #1
Okay. And what are you reading at the minute? One fiction and one nonfiction recommendation or just what you're reading?
- Speaker #0
Yeah, I have sworn off nonfiction after reading exclusively nonfiction for like six years straight. So I'm not reading any nonfiction. Wow. I picked up this book called The Witch Collector. which is a really fun like romanticist book following um a uh like a society where a witch is collected from a village every year to help fight in this war uh and it's very fun so far so that's the current one that i'm reading what's the reason for non-fiction i overdosed on reading way too much non-fiction so i i put myself through this like like self-development bender yeah yeah like i think all of it in a minute yeah Yeah. Yeah. And I think that everyone has to go through that. So I read like Rich Dad, Poor Dad. I read like The Mountain Is You, Your Body Keeps the Score. Like I like stacked up like 30 like self-help development finance books. And when I got to the end of it and they started to like I started to read nonfiction books, they started to reference other books that I'd read. I'm like, yeah, we're all starting like the echo chamber. I'm in the echo chamber. And so when I the thing that kind of broke my reading slump in fiction was. um i finally realized that i was being a baby and i was making fun of all of these best-selling books in the fiction realm like i was like sneering at them and looking down at them but then i picked up akotar and then i couldn't sleep for a week and i just like stayed up till like 3 a.m reading these books i'm like all right i'm back to fiction i just needed to read what was popular and everybody loves because those books are popular and everyone loves them for a reason and so that's kind of what brought me back into fiction is not being a snob and reading books that are popular okay
- Speaker #1
okay And the last couple of questions for the quick fire travel questions. Where have you been this year?
- Speaker #0
Yeah, Japan, Turkey, South Korea, London, and like the UK and Edinburgh, and Poland, and Argentina, and in the States for a little bit, and a few other places I'm probably forgetting.
- Speaker #1
Okay, and Madeira, of course, where you are now.
- Speaker #0
And Madeira, yeah.
- Speaker #1
What's coming up for next year? Do you have any?
- Speaker #0
plans already in place or is that too soon a little too soon i'm currently trying to plan a trip to paris in a few weeks and then um potentially a trip to go see one of my ghostwriting clients and so trying to lock that into place first because i'm going to try to catch glass animals in concert in paris and all right overlap some work work trip stuff so yeah but i've been obsessed with glass animals as a band so i'm trying to see them in person and it's like my schedule has always like been the wrong wrong place wrong time
- Speaker #1
Okay, and we're going to finish with some quickfire travel questions. These are some of your favourite things forever from Travelwise. So I might throw in a few digital nomad ones. I'll kind of make them up on the spot. So let's kick off with... It's travel question time. You've given us three favourite places, but if tomorrow there are no rules and you can go anywhere in the world, three places, what are your top three?
- Speaker #0
Yeah, I always want to go to Amsterdam and Switzerland and Sweden. I haven't gone because Northern Europe is very expensive and very cold at the times that I'm wanting to go. But I feel like Northern Europe is like the untouched place that I haven't gone yet. And I haven't used up all my travel days and user days like every year. So it's always like tricky and then it gets too cold.
- Speaker #1
Okay. And as you mentioned it, what about food places that are not necessarily new?
- Speaker #0
Not necessarily new. I would always go back to Lisbon. I think it's great. I would go back to... porto which is also a great city of portugal yeah um and then i'm excited to go back to paris and so that's the the third place like i had a really good time the first time that i was there okay are you a sunrise or sunset person sunset i like sleeping in everyone
- Speaker #1
says that i've not really met anyone said sunrise yet unreal okay and you mentioned one tip before about being a minimalist but maybe three other key tips of being digital nomad you
- Speaker #0
Yeah, I think my favorite travel gadget has been packing a heated jacket so that you can reduce your jacket, like and be able to like be able to like have like different seasons with just one jacket. And so having a heated jacket has been like my greatest travel hack. I've had one for the last two years that I love. So I think it also has a phone charger in the battery. You can charge your phone while you're getting warm. So I think that that's something that everyone always asks me about when I'm wearing them. Like, yeah, this is it. And then the second thing would be to really travel hack with credit card points if you're based in Canada or America, because I've been able to get almost like 80 to 90% of my flights for free this year. And I think that that is like some big long haul ones too. So I think that really kind of like maximizing travel hacking, it's annoying to learn, but it really pays off in the long run. Three, I think everybody who is traveling should keep some sort of travel blog or travel diary or sub stab where they're sharing their travels with other people because it's not only a great way to meet people, but it's also a great way to like have an income stream to monetize and then also just capture your travel so you can look back on them and look back on them fondly and kind of explore the destinations through the way that you've captured it in a moment because if you don't capture it while you're there, it'll just kind of start to fade from your memory.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, or you can podcast it like I did last year.
- Speaker #0
Exactly.
- Speaker #1
On average, two a week. Yeah. And I haven't listened back actually. Be quite interested, maybe in a few years, but that does document pretty much everything that we did. If you don't want to write, just speak into a dictaphone or microphone. That'd be a good way to do it.
- Speaker #0
Yeah. Definitely, yeah.
- Speaker #1
Okay. If you could sit somewhere for an afternoon and read a book and watch the world go by, where are you going to sit?
- Speaker #0
Probably on the balcony that we have here in Madeira that overlooks the ocean. You can't get better than that. It's nice to be right here and to just watch the sunset. And so I feel like that's been the prime reading spot.
- Speaker #1
Okay. What about top three favorite cuisines that you've experienced on your travels?
- Speaker #0
Yeah. Number one is definitely the Turkish breakfast. I will not stop talking about how great that is. It's so, so good. I'm a big breakfast person. And then I think Turkish, I guess I would say second, I would say Turkish food in general. There's some really cool kind of like the Turkish ravioli. I just, everything I had in Turkey was amazing. And I would go back to just eat food in Turkey for like another month straight because it was so good. And then I really did like, I think the ramen in Japan was just next level. Like we'd be at like a train station in Tokyo and then I would have ramen that just like blew my mind. I'm like, what is this? This is so good. And so I think that I love I also love ramen. And I think that Japan just like really cornered the market on that. And then also Korean food outside of Korea, because when I was in Korea, there was no good vegetarian food.
- Speaker #1
It was a nightmare. It was a nightmare. We struggled here.
- Speaker #0
But then when I left Korea and I had like vegetarian Korean dishes in Singapore and these other places, I was like, this is amazing. This is so good. And so bibimbap made by people outside of Korea is fantastic. In Korea, they will put a beef, like a steak with beef in there and be like, here you go. I'm like, I can't, no. And so, yeah, bad, bad place for vegetarians.
- Speaker #1
We found one amazing place in Gangnam, in Seoul. It's in the big shopping center there. And I think the restaurant's called Plantitude.
- Speaker #0
I think I went there. Yeah, I went there.
- Speaker #1
They had amazing vegan Korean food. That was incredible. A bit pricey. But that's what makes Korea a bit of a nightmare for that because you can't find on the street. But if you're looking to maybe find something, yeah, you went there. I found it pretty incredible, to be fair.
- Speaker #0
Yeah, there was some fine dining, like vegetarian options. But like even I went to like a burrito shop and they would refuse to take the meat out of the burrito and just serve me the rice and the beans. I'm like, it's right. You just like there's something against like vegetarians there where they just they don't they don't like you.
- Speaker #1
I understand that. Yeah, that's interesting. Okay, what about three places as a digital nomad that you might have heard in your community or in your groups that people are saying you've got to at least try to be a digital nomad there? Not necessarily travel, but maybe be based somewhere. Is there three places that you've heard that are on your radar for the future?
- Speaker #0
Yeah, people have talked about Mexico City that I haven't been yet. I've had some friends have had some bad experiences in Mexico, like very bad. And so I've kind of been a little bit like I haven't been back. I've been to Mexico a long time ago. But. I've heard Mexico City the food is amazing and it's a big digital nomad hub. And then Chiang Mai in Thailand. I've heard amazing things about that. And everybody just says it's fantastic. So that's been on my radar. And then Bali, of course, everyone talks about Bali, but I've heard that it's overrated. But I feel like I should go, but I don't know. And that's the one where some of my nomad friends are like, it's not overrated, you've got to go. And then other people are like, it's way overrated, don't go. So I think. Yeah, and so I think I run into, it's very difficult to understand who's opinion to trust with some of these places. And so I think Madeira was one that everyone said go to, and they were totally right.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, I talk about it a lot on my podcast. I probably won't talk about it again. I haven't been for 10 years, so maybe it's outdated. But even back then, I was like, oh, wow, I thought it was a bit out of control. But I don't know what it's like now. But there you go. Yeah, you might like it. I'm not sure. Okay. A favorite walk, hike, or trek that you've done? Maybe not Inca Trail. You mentioned that a few times.
- Speaker #0
I know. I just love it so much. I think, well, we did a walk through the foggy forest here in Madera that I thought was really unique. Because it's just like you go from like you drive up the mountain, it's sunny and beautiful, and all of a sudden you get to the peak of the mountain and it just fog descends and you just can't see more than like a few feet in front of you. And then you're walking through this foggy forest and all of a sudden these trees that are like, like... her old like witch's hands are like reaching out at you and it's just like very cool then there's only i'll walk past you and you're like what are you doing here and so it feels like you're in this weird dreamlike surreal cloud in this forest and like you you can easily get lost so it's like you kind of have to be careful to like stay on a trail because otherwise it'll just get swallowed up by the fog and so i think the foggy forest here in portugal i love like places where there's like the cloud forest on the inco trails also great but the foggy forest here in portugal is really cool you
- Speaker #1
Have you done the Stairway to Heaven trail?
- Speaker #0
Is that the one in the foggy forest? Yeah,
- Speaker #1
it goes right along the top, right? It goes to a point. Might be the wrong name for it.
- Speaker #0
I've been traumatized by stairs and staying in a trail. I'm like, I'm not...
- Speaker #1
I was saying...
- Speaker #0
If I see... If I so much as look at another pair of stairs on a hiking trail, it's been too much. It's too much. I think I'm... I'm a hiker, but I'm like... I don't like pain.
- Speaker #1
I think I'm exactly the same. I was doing research the other day on the one in Guatemala, in Antigua, the volcano hike. And it's coming up for me in November. And my biggest thing, apart from my hip, which is a bit dodgy, the second thing is, has it got stairs? I don't think it does. I think it's just volcanic ash. So not like hard setting, which is a problem, but Mount Fuji, which is the same thing and it's fine. But like no stairs. I can't deal with rocks or steps. And I had that problem last year in Nepal and Langtang where there are big rock steps. And I... I just get done in. I can't do no more steps.
- Speaker #0
It's not enjoyable. You like look at them. You just look at them and you see the pain your body is about to go through and you're like, no, I don't want this. Like, let's skip to the good part.
- Speaker #1
Yeah, I don't mind like an incline where it's just a normal ground. That's fine, but no steps. No steps. Okay, and the last question will be for someone who's listening right now, they could be either scared to go traveling or just can't make that jump to go international traveling or even to another state. but also maybe alongside that in a career, maybe a bit unhappy or unsure how to change their life. Any couple of sentences of wisdom that you can pass on to maybe why someone should travel and maybe at least give it a go?
- Speaker #0
Yeah, I think that you have to live life to write about life. And whether you're a writer or creator or just somebody, you know, moving through the world, you want to live a life where you're well-lived. And I think that you have to put yourself out there and do things that seem a little scary or a little hard because... if you the other side everything that you want is on the other side of your fear as everyone says and I think that's so true and there's a lot of things that I was terrified to do I was terrified of traveling I was terrified of leaving my Los Angeles apartment in the middle of COVID while I had an autoimmune disease and was like on these crazy like medications that were hurting my immune system and I was like but I feel like if I do this anyway something is going to change my life like Italian pizza and I was right and so it's like the thing that I was on the other thing of the thing you're fearing is really good sourdough pizza in Naples and that's worth any plane flight.
- Speaker #1
Wow. I never thought I'd hear how pizza could be such a game changer in quite a significant and serious life condition.
- Speaker #2
Yeah. Like sourdough has good like gut bacteria.
- Speaker #0
Yeah. Like I would have loved pizza just like emotionally without that but it's actually good for your gut.
- Speaker #1
Wow, there you go. Science. Awesome. Amy, thanks for coming to the podcast. It's been a great chat. Learned a lot. Very inspirational with your travels and your digital nomad stuff and also working as a freelancer. I think the audience will get a lot out of this and I'm really excited to share it.
- Speaker #0
Awesome. Thanks so much for having me, James.
- Speaker #1
Thank you, Amy. Cheers.
- Speaker #3
Thanks for tuning in to the podcast episode today. If you've been inspired by today's chat and want to book some travel, if you head to the show notes, you'll see some affiliate links below which help support this podcast. You'll find Skyscanner to book your flight. You'll find Booking.com to book that accommodation. Want to stay in a super cool hostel? You'll see Hostelworld down there too. You'll find Revolut to get your travel card sorted. Click the GigSky link to get your eSIM ready for your trip. And more importantly, you'll find Safety Wing Insurance to get that travel insurance for your trip. There are many more to check out, so when you click that link and book your product, a small commission goes towards me and the Wiganet Travel Podcast. Thank you in advance and enjoy your travels.
